[saltysenior]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

Very easily ... how many races has she won ??? I believe you can count them all on one finger !

Derrick Cope won the Daytona 500 ... does that make him a great NASCAR driver ??? I don't think so.

i do not believe you have to be ''great'' or ''win'' to drive a NASCAR race....how many in tonite's race are ''great'' or race winners???..25%???....the other 75% seem to be happy and are most likely doing well financially.....the bottom line is she will follow the money trail no matter what we think..

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by saltysenior

i do not believe you have to be ''great'' or ''win'' to drive a NASCAR race....how many in tonite's race are ''great'' or race winners???..25%???....the other 75% seem to be happy and are most likely doing well financially.....the bottom line is she will follow the money trail no matter what we think..

That point I will not argue and you are correct in that we may perceive ALL NASCAR drivers as great but ..... many of them are far greater than she is. Great is a matter of perspective. In comparison I'd consider David Ragan a great driver. Compare him to Tony and you have a totally different perspective of what and who is great. Sam Hornish (open wheeler) is a rolling accident. Very few good drivers in open wheel make the successful transition to cup cars. If it were that easy they'd all be here for the money. I don't care if she does make th etransition but do it because you have the ability to drive and finish well, not to sell trash and trinkets. Haven't we got enough of those drivers already ???

Most importantly your final statement says it all $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

Very easily ... how many races has she won ??? I believe you can count them all on one finger !

Derrick Cope won the Daytona 500 ... does that make him a great NASCAR driver ??? I don't think so.

From where I stand, just about every driver who gets to regularly compete in the highest levels of any of the major series, is a darn good driver. Off the top of my head I can think of only one or two who absolutely did not deserve to compete at the highest level.

Taking Danica'a driving abilities brings us back to that old ans stake question, "What makes a driver great? How do you measure 'greatness?'"
Who would we be talking about more, Jimmy Johnson with the #71 team, or David Gilliland if he were in the #48 with Knaus as his crew chief?

Would Dale Earnhardt Jr. sell a hundredth of the tee shirts and ball caps he currently sells if his last name was Shultz?

Would David Pearson have ever gotten his Wood Brothers ride if he'd been driving only for Tom Spell or Bob Osborne, instead of Cotton Owens?

Bottom line know that there are levels of talent. Just because our gal Danica isn't at the top level doesn't make her another Rick Wilson. Yeah, a lot of her appeal is her using her magnetism to the other gender. One of my person favourites, Tim Richmond, was guilty of the same type of behaviour. It's all relative, I guess.

But bob101 is right when he says if she comes to NA__AR (which I seriously doubt that she ever will), it'll be a media feeding frenzy which might temporarily give NA__AR some hype but it'll be about Danica and NOT about her racing, which will be mediocre at best. Does NA__AR NEED that type of sensationalistic notoriety?

[jks812]

Could you imagine her coming to Nascar and throwing one of her hissy fits and shoving or slapping one of these guys? The wives of nascar would have her for lunch.

[bob101]

I wouldn't mind women racing in cup...just not here. I watched 2 women in NHRA tear it up for a number of years in the pro ranks. Didn't bother me at all.

Of course if you say you don't like her or don't want her in NASCAR it must be because she is a woman, not becuase you just don't like her.

I find it interesting those promoting her #6 in points....without looking on the internet I wonder how many can name the top 10 in points. Or even get ALL 5 of those ahead of her?

[saltysenior]

Originally Posted by bob101

I wouldn't mind women racing in cup...just not here. I watched 2 women in NHRA tear it up for a number of years in the pro ranks. Didn't bother me at all.

Of course if you say you don't like her or don't want her in NASCAR it must be because she is a woman, not becuase you just don't like her.

I find it interesting those promoting her #6 in points....without looking on the internet I wonder how many can name the top 10 in points. Or even get ALL 5 of those ahead of her?

how many of us can name the starting line up for the n.y yankees 0r the cleveland cavaliers ,ect........yet all are thought to be the among the best in their sport....... i r l just does not have the following that nascur has...could it be because they seem not to have a ''hero worship''type fanbase?????

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

But bob101 is right when he says if she comes to NA__AR (which I seriously doubt that she ever will), it'll be a media feeding frenzy which might temporarily give NA__AR some hype but it'll be about Danica and NOT about her racing, which will be mediocre at best. Does NA__AR NEED that type of sensationalistic notoriety?

I guess that is part of what I'm trying to convey. We have enough "Stars" who are media hypes versus contenders and NASCAR really needs to be more about racing versus entertainment.

When asked this morning on SPEED's Trackside show, what rules need changing, David Pearson suggested "all of them". Basically he suggested the impossible, but he would love to see it go back to when teams controlled their destiny instead of NASCAR.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

I guess that is part of what I'm trying to convey. We have enough "Stars" who are media hypes versus contenders and NASCAR really needs to be more about racing versus entertainment.

When asked this morning on SPEED's Trackside show, what rules need changing, David Pearson suggested "all of them". Basically he suggested the impossible, but he would love to see it go back to when teams controlled their destiny instead of NASCAR.

But, as we all know, David Pearson is just another "Old Man" who doesn't know what's best for NA__AR. He's a nobody who won't accept this brave, new world of NA__AR, an old guy who thinks winning races isn't as important as "The BIG picture."

What does HE know about racing? After all, his name isn't Busch, Earnhardt or Gordon and he hasn't won seven Cup championships? Heck. He probably doesn't have a mansion on Lake Norman or a penthouse in NYC!

Change all the rules? Why, those rules are what gave us the mega teams, the playoff, the Chosen 35 and Lucky Dawgs. What the heck does he want? Real racing? Doesn't he know that government (NA__AR) is the answer to all the problems, and what NA__AR decrees is to be accepted without dissent? Don't complain about it, even if asked. Just accept it or just go away and let the people who have bought into this new NA__AR enjoy it.

[jay1594]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

everyone knows it's the bikini that's alluring, not the talent.


that aside, consider this: in the past several years we've seen several drivers who are multiple time champions in other types of cars come to NASCAR only to struggle. (Hornish, Allmendinger, Ambrose, Montoya, Villenueve, to name a few) It's no reflection on these people, it's just that when you reach the levels these people have (they've become specialists, if you will), many things are ingrained about driving and it's really hard to to go from one style to a completely different style. You almost have to completely unlearn what you know and relearn something else. An occasional few hours in an ALMS car for a 12 or 24 hour event isn't an indicator how well that transition will go.

I applaud folks like John Andretti, Tony Stewart, and Robby Gordon who are able to shift from one top tier series to a different top tier series and do as well as they have. But, each has a primary and a secondary: one in which they excel and one in which they are just "competent".

Danica has benefited from being a member of a super-team (Andretti Green) .. I doubt she would have achieved the success she has if not for that.

Struggling??? Hornish, Allmendinger and Ambrose have shown steady improvements each week. Not to mention Montoya who won the pool at Dega. I believe Nascar would benefit from Danica moving over, not to mention the whole bikini thing ( ) , but the world of Nascar may be once again unveiled to the Fan Base of Nascar. I mean will she do good in her first few years probably not, but I can see her in the future possibly accomplishing something in our sport. I mean the days are numbered until I believe Montoya wins again, and Possibly The Dinger, and Ambrose and Hornish aren't far off either, they have all shown that they can be competitive.

[Racer Duck]

I didn't say those guys weren't improving. But they're already Champions in their respective previous series. Champions are expected to show improvement in their first season, not take 2 or 3. Of the lot, only Montoya is now where he should have been last season at this time.

Contrast these Champions progress with Joey Logano and Brad Keselowski.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by bob101

I wouldn't mind women racing in cup...just not here. I watched 2 women in NHRA tear it up for a number of years in the pro ranks. Didn't bother me at all.

Of course if you say you don't like her or don't want her in NASCAR it must be because she is a woman, not becuase you just don't like her.

I find it interesting those promoting her #6 in points....without looking on the internet I wonder how many can name the top 10 in points. Or even get ALL 5 of those ahead of her?

Unfortunately there have been women in NASCAR (behind the wheel, in the driver's seat) since the start, but none have done well. Patty Moise probably had the best success, but it still pales when compared to the average NASCAR driver.

Danica is doing good right now .. and must be maturing some since her interviews are much better this year (or Michael has spent a ton of money
"educating/training" her on PR.)

I'd say she's probably the best female open wheel driver in the world, right now. Or at least the most well known.

But most of her popularity didn't come from her driving, but from her bikini.

Sarah Fisher, on the other hand, has yet to appear in any publication in a bikini. But she does have the endorsement of several female racing drivers (something Danica doesn't have.) Unfortunately (and maybe because she hasn't appeared in a bikini), she's having trouble finding sponsorship and doesn't have the deep pockets to get the best of equipment and personnel that Danica has.

Ashley Force is the only female racing driver I know of who is dominant in her sport. A lot of it is her talent, but consideration has to be given to the fact that she's the daughter of a 14 time champ and mega star in drag racing and has had all the best of everything her whole career to help her grow into the star that she is.

And she beats Danica in the looks department hands down (according to several polls run in 2008!)

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

Unfortunately there have been women in NASCAR (behind the wheel, in the driver's seat) since the start, but none have done well. Patty Moise probably had the best success, but it still pales when compared to the average NASCAR driver.

Danica is doing good right now .. and must be maturing some since her interviews are much better this year (or Michael has spent a ton of money
"educating/training" her on PR.)

I'd say she's probably the best female open wheel driver in the world, right now. Or at least the most well known.

But most of her popularity didn't come from her driving, but from her bikini.

Sarah Fisher, on the other hand, has yet to appear in any publication in a bikini. But she does have the endorsement of several female racing drivers (something Danica doesn't have.) Unfortunately (and maybe because she hasn't appeared in a bikini), she's having trouble finding sponsorship and doesn't have the deep pockets to get the best of equipment and personnel that Danica has.

Ashley Force is the only female racing driver I know of who is dominant in her sport. A lot of it is her talent, but consideration has to be given to the fact that she's the daughter of a 14 time champ and mega star in drag racing and has had all the best of everything her whole career to help her grow into the star that she is.

And she beats Danica in the looks department hands down (according to several polls run in 2008!)

I guess what you are saying is that Ashley takes after her Mother and not dear ole' Daddy.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

I guess what you are saying is that Ashley takes after her Mother and not dear ole' Daddy.

She has her Daddy's talent (without the perpetual motion mouth) and her Mother's good looks.... Luckily for them, all of the Force girls have their mother's good looks!

[loco4pablo]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

Unfortunately there have been women in NASCAR (behind the wheel, in the driver's seat) since the start, but none have done well. Patty Moise probably had the best success, but it still pales when compared to the average NASCAR driver.

Danica is doing good right now .. and must be maturing some since her interviews are much better this year (or Michael has spent a ton of money
"educating/training" her on PR.)

I'd say she's probably the best female open wheel driver in the world, right now. Or at least the most well known.

But most of her popularity didn't come from her driving, but from her bikini.

Sarah Fisher, on the other hand, has yet to appear in any publication in a bikini. But she does have the endorsement of several female racing drivers (something Danica doesn't have.) Unfortunately (and maybe because she hasn't appeared in a bikini), she's having trouble finding sponsorship and doesn't have the deep pockets to get the best of equipment and personnel that Danica has.

Ashley Force is the only female racing driver I know of who is dominant in her sport. A lot of it is her talent, but consideration has to be given to the fact that she's the daughter of a 14 time champ and mega star in drag racing and has had all the best of everything her whole career to help her grow into the star that she is.

And she beats Danica in the looks department hands down (according to several polls run in 2008!)

Maybe Sarah Fisher should break out that Bikini and start drumming up sponsorship and PR!

Angelle Sampey is the most dominate female racer in my opinion.

Hillary Will has a lot of potential... She just needs a ☻☻☻☻ job!

[bob101]

Let me ask you this....

Do you think the person above and/or below her in points (who may/may not have had a longer career with more wins) would get a test ride in NASCAR complete with sponsorship right off the bat including insane media coverage.....didn't think so.

Now tell me again how it's "all about talent".