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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? Who are these guys [Mark Fainaru-Wada and Lance Williams] and how did they supposedly learn all of this? Not that I doubt it per se, but that's a whole truckload of inside info not everyone would have access to. |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? Below is a quick read of this story from Yahoo Sports... http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slu...v=ap&type=lgns Very interesting read, I will be interested to hear some reactions. |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? Barry Bonds is definitely not the only cheater out there, but his attitude towards everyone else over the duration of his career make him more of a target than some others, say Mark McGuire or Sammy Sosa, two guys that were fan friendly. Bonds is the most talented player of his generation when you consider his gold gloves, stolen bases, and batting average throughout his career. I have never like him personally but can't deny his greatness. Do I think he would be chasing all the HR records if he had not used performance enhancing drugs? No, I don't think so, but I do believe he would still be a Hall of Famer. |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? Quote:
And desertrat- the guy was a great player before he started taking steroids. He was a shoe in Hall of Famer. Now I wonder after all of these revelations if they sportswriters are going to keep him out as punishment. Even Frank Robinson said that Palmiero's records should all be abolished from the record book. Shouldn't the same theory go for Bonds? I'll say this: As far as I'm concerned: McGwire, Sosa or Bonds never broke Maris's record and I don't care if Bonds passes Ruth and Aarron - his record is tainted. |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? That's some pretty damning evidence that throws a whole new light on Bonds' achievements. It also begs the question of whether a person ever belongs in the Hall of Fame if he was found to have been using performing enhancing drugs at some point in his career. I completely understand the disgust of some players with the fact that they just can't shine when compared to the cheaters, and I even understand (but don't condone) why they decide to start using the drugs themselves. What's up next -- are they going to have to have separate categories in the Hall of Fame for natural and "enhanced" achievements? And what in the heck will they do when bionic implants are perfected? I don't mean to be flip -- I can see that as being a serious problem in the future. Where do you draw the line on enhancements, and if you do, are you cheating the fans of some extra excitement? That said, these revelations about BB make you wonder how much of his nasty attitude is due to steroid use. Or was he like that before? |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? I must have missed the meeting when this became new information. We all knew Bonds was doping, baseball knew he was doping, and yes some of this information is relevant because it grants us more specifics, but what about this report that is enlightening? Here’s what bothers me more than anything. The fact that Bonds was able to get away with this for years, and the fact that legitimately, Bonds can still get away with a lot because baseball refuses to test for Human Growth Hormone. It’s a blood test, and it wasn’t bargained into the last labor deal that HGH could be tested. The only test that can be administered to major league ballplayers is that of a urine specimen, and even then it’s only once a year. With the masking agents that this article does a good job explaining, and the HGH that Bonds were inducing to himself, it’s no wonder he was able to get away with so much for so long. What I mean is, even with the new testing, he’s still not getting caught, because he knows what he uses won’t be subjected to anything remotely resembling a penalty. Another thing that makes me sick about this whole deal is people like Tim Kurjian, Peter Gammons, who flat out say we couldn’t judge Bonds because h he was never caught for anything. Kurjian has said before that he’d still vote for him in terms of the Hall of Fame because there’s no ACTUAL proof Bonds did anything. I think it was Kurjian who also said (as have other writers) that even if we DID find out Bonds did stuff, he’d still vote for him, because in his mind he was a Hall-of-Famer before he started taking the steroids. Yet the hypocrisy of the baseball writers and such is that they keep Pete Rose out, even though, in my view, he was a Hall-of Famer before he started betting on baseball. Some sins are ok, others are not. Interesting. |
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| Re: Hey Bonds supporters -what do you think now? This is the sort of thing that MLB did NOT want happening just as the season is getting into real action (albeit Spring Training/WBC action). Bonds will likely enforce some sort of lawsuit against the writers/publishers but there's no way to prove he's innocent. I'm sure the writers have records, evidence and everything in writing to cover themselves. I read somewhere that they went indepth into their sources. Still though, Bonds will get cheered by San Fran fans and people will go to the parks to watch him. It's not going to change. |
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| The Bonds Saga continues... Has anyone ever, in any imaginable field, gotten more airtime for announcing he's made no decision than Bud Selig? With molasses-like quickness has Selig thought on any number of issues through his tenure as "commissioner" (read: owners' lackey). So now it's the Barry Bonds scandal. Selig denied that the owners' lackey's office has even begun an investigation on Bonds' love affair with steroids, presumably because Selig's employees are paid to waffle, not think. Or act. In a marvelous quote, Selig was his usual eloquent self: "There really is nothing new ... I spent the airplane ride out here today thinking about it and I'll continue to do that. ... I have made no decision. I've made no decision yet. You know, it's something I'd rather not discuss right now. I'll make the decision based on all the factors that are involved ..." He added that "A lot of people write books and do a lot of things to sell their books, and that doesn't really come into play here at all." "Yeah," as Bouton was wont to say in Ball Four, "surrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre." Except that, without the pre-release of certain written matter, Selig would have simply ignored everything. Hell, Selig did his best in avoidance already: On the day when the World Baseball Classic (Selig's "baby" and indeed perhaps the only positive element the man has added to the game) opened in America, Selig somehow avoided the game in Anaheim. Naturally, this had nothing to do with the fact that Bonds was also in Anaheim. Let's say it again: Yeah, surrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre. It's ironic that Kenesaw Mountain Landis was named baseball's first commissioner as protection against individual players or outside interests from seizing control of the game away from the owners. Every single owner's lackey thereafter has been unabashedly anti-player (anyone remember Bowie Kuhn?) except for the unduly mistreated Fay Vincent. Now, the MLB has an owner as owner's lackey and here he is, handing players the power to "change the conditions of the game" (i.e. cheat, essentially) while he turns his back and allows cheap padding of stats. What would Landis do today? He'd clean house. This is not to say that Landis was fair to the players or unbiased, but he would have had the game cleared up at the first whiff of drug use. Selig, on the other hand, apparently doesn't want to talk about the past. My prediction: Bonds doesn't get investigated until after his retirement, at which point his records go in the books and mainstream sportswriters can excuse his lying statistics by saying such artificial assistance wasn't against the rules until 2005 or so. And meanwhile, we can await a Selig decision that will never come. We should probably be thankful, however, because the last time he had to make a spot decision we got the silliest result ever in the 2002 All-Star Game. Cheers, all.
__________________ sports.candyham.com |
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