[Gotham Dark Knight]

Steve Carlton went 27-10 with a 1.98 ERA and 310 K's for a 1972 Phillies Team that went 62-94 was that the best pitching performance this half century?

[wedge]

There are better seasons as far as numbers go. Like Gibson, McLain in 1968, few Koufax years and a dozen others I'm sure. But a closer took at some stats and you'll see just how truly amazing his season turned out.

That year "The Bull" Luzinski was the Phils best hitter (statistically). 281 avg with 18 hrs. The next closest in average, from the starters, Tim Hutton at .260! So I can't imagine his run support was very good. He did lose 10 games with a below 2.00 era.

Now for another stat. He won 45.7% of his team's games (27 of the 59). That is the highest percentage in modern day baseball!!

You might find more impressive numbers, but you won't find a better season by a pitcher, considering the circumstances, then the 1972 Carlton one.

Good pick Gotham! You da man!

[ThePundit]

Ron Guidry's 25-3 in 1978 was the best I ever saw. Of course, I'm a Yankee fan and saw every game so I'm very biased.

That year, the guy was unhittable. Other teams would stack righties against him and they just couldn't pull the ball.

He mowed down 18 Angels in 1 game. He also pitched on 3 days rest in the Bucky Dent game against Bostonand pitched very well with his arm hanging off.

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by wedge

Now for another stat. He won 45.7% of his team's games (27 of the 59). That is the highest percentage in modern day baseball!!

You might find more impressive numbers, but you won't find a better season by a pitcher, considering the circumstances, then the 1972 Carlton one.

Good pick Gotham! You da man!

Wedge!...Crunching the numbers I see my good man...45.7% boys and girls...Carlton was the team....on any other team the man nails 30-32 wins!...we have to take that into account...come on all you haters...get on the Lefty's band wagon...admit it...it was purely the best season bar none...

[Wizard of Os]

Cheers everyone!

Pundit, you are dead on. For one year, Ron Guidry was Cy Young himself. The Yankees came back through July and August and September that year to get a one-game playoff with the Red Sox. Gid wins "only" 24, they don't tie the 'Sox, the don't win the 'Series and they never repeat in the 70s. He carried a megastar team through their insane difficulties that year.

Denny McLain's 1968 season at 31-6 should probably be well considered...

And then there's my favorite. Greg Maddux, 1994: 16-6 in 25 games (10 CG) with a 1.56 ERA. Of course, we'll never know what he might have accomplished in a proper season...

In 1995, Maddux was smokin' hot, too: 19-2 in 28 games (10 CG) with a measly 1.63. That was also the year the perennial bridesmaid Braves won the World Series.

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by Wizard of Os

Cheers everyone!

Pundit, you are dead on. For one year, Ron Guidry was Cy Young himself. The Yankees came back through July and August and September that year to get a one-game playoff with the Red Sox. Gid wins "only" 24, they don't tie the 'Sox, the don't win the 'Series and they never repeat in the 70s. He carried a megastar team through their insane difficulties that year.

Denny McLain's 1968 season at 31-6 should probably be well considered...

And then there's my favorite. Greg Maddux, 1994: 16-6 in 25 games (10 CG) with a 1.56 ERA. Of course, we'll never know what he might have accomplished in a proper season...

In 1995, Maddux was smokin' hot, too: 19-2 in 28 games (10 CG) with a measly 1.63. That was also the year the perennial bridesmaid Braves won the World Series.

Guys, guys, guys...you are soooo missing the point...Mclain, Maddux, "Louisiana Lighting" Ron Guidry...and Gibson with his fabled 1.12 ERA all had Championship caliber teams backing them...Mr. Carlton was a one man show...On a championship team we are talking at least 5 more wins and there would not even be an argument...

I remember Guidry's season...Maddux was my favorite in the 90's and Mclain bless "his little convict heart," I even have a 1968 Topps baseball card of...But my man Carlton stands alone...One man one season...which by the way was short by about 6 games!...still puts out 27 wins on a team that should not have had a 12 game winner...how can you argue?...I mean so Lefty hated the media...hey does that make him a bad guy...Say it with me..."....One man...One Season...Carlton stands alone!"..."One man...One Season...Carlton stands alone!"...come on now, hop on the band wagon.. you can say it...

[Wizard of Os]

Cheers Knight (and all others)!

Have you ever seen A Fish Called Wanda? Remember the bit when the Kevin Kline character is practicing having to apologize to John Cleese's barrister? That's me, attempting to push out Gotham's words:

"Carlton sssssssssssssss..."

"Carlton staaands aaaaaaaaaaaaa..."

"Carlton sssssssssssss..."

I'm still going with Gid here. All right, Carlton contributed 40% of his team's wins that year, but where's the pressure?

Again, Gid carried that Yankees through their down times. The Bronx Bombers may have been world champions at the end of 1978, but they weren't playing like it until well after the all-star break. Isn't it a bit easier to get loose in late August, if your team has been out of contention since the All-Star break?

In my opinion, having a championship team "playing behind" a pitcher is not a negative mark and does not detract from "dominance" at all. If Gid and Maddux, to name two, are integral to a championship team's success, aren't they one of those championship players?

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by Wizard of Os

Cheers Knight (and all others)!

Have you ever seen A Fish Called Wanda? Remember the bit when the Kevin Kline character is practicing having to apologize to John Cleese's barrister? That's me, attempting to push out Gotham's words:

"Carlton sssssssssssssss..."

"Carlton staaands aaaaaaaaaaaaa..."

"Carlton sssssssssssss..."

I'm still going with Gid here. All right, Carlton contributed 40% of his team's wins that year, but where's the pressure?

Again, Gid carried that Yankees through their down times. The Bronx Bombers may have been world champions at the end of 1978, but they weren't playing like it until well after the all-star break. Isn't it a bit easier to get loose in late August, if your team has been out of contention since the All-Star break?

In my opinion, having a championship team "playing behind" a pitcher is not a negative mark and does not detract from "dominance" at all. If Gid and Maddux, to name two, are integral to a championship team's success, aren't they one of those championship players?

Wiz my man...All I was asking for was an effort...You were baby stepping man!...You got a few letters out bro!...You were getting there...that's all I am asking for...Pressure you ask?...My man, there was pressure...pressure of knowing you gotta finish the darn thing cause you ain't got no help out of the pen...pressure in having to be perfect on every throw cause you ain't got no hitting behind you!...but hey, its noble of you man...A+ for effort bro...and A+ for working in a comedy bit...that's all I am asking for...I'll finish it for you man..."One man...One season...Carlton stands alone..." see there, not hard at all!...But hey thanks for playing Wiz, you are a class guy!...

As I recall, there was an all-star game that Carlton started. I suspect it was not this session(1972) but it impressed me. The first inning he started throwing the slider. He walks 2-3 for the ump wasn't calling the strikes and strikes out 3 - no runs. It was very impressive. That slider of his was pretty unhittable. I am not sure how many innings he pitched but he did not allow a run.

Carlton pitched 30 complete games. His ERA was 1.97. He had eight shutouts. He struck out 310 batters in 346 innings pitched.

He went 27-10 for a terrible team that won 59 games all year. He had to have an ERA under 2.00 just to win with this team.

I see this as the greatest pitching season in major league history. The fact that he did it with a bad team is truly incredible.

[njpsufan]

Ok, I will throw some fuel on the fire. I would agree Carlton's season was the best ever, and I use this logic. There have been plenty of great pitchers who have had great seasons...Guidry, McClain, Gibson, Gooden, etc. But they have all had great season with great teams. Guidry in 1978 was with a Yanks team that won the WS that year and the year before. McClain's Tigers won the Ws in 1968. Heck even my most unfavorite Philly, Schilling, had great year.... in 1983, 2001 and 2004...all with teams that went to the WS. To me the mark of a great pitcher is one who dominates on a team that is crap. Carlton is the pinnacle of that. The only other person close is Randy Jones for the Padres in 1976. He goes 22-14, 2.74ERA, 40 starts with 25 CG on a team that went 73-89. That was a great performance. Greinke is having a good year this year for a horrible Royals team... imagine if he played for the Dodgers or the Yanks?? We would be handing him the CY award already.