[Lefty Noob]

... and that the Lakers, for some reason or another, traded him to New York for Starbury before the season. Do the Knicks make the playoffs with Bryant on their team?

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by Lefty Noob

... and that the Lakers, for some reason or another, traded him to New York for Starbury before the season. Do the Knicks make the playoffs with Bryant on their team?

Nope...4 guys would watch Kobe shoot...he would have a 40 ppg average, and the team would average about 80 ppg.

[ThePundit]

No. I agree with Gotham. And can you imagine Larry Brown coaching Koby? There would be better headlines than the Starbury headlines of this year.
And get this: The Bulls not only get the Knicks lottery pick this year but have the option of switching picks in 2006-2007. So if the Knicks have another lousy year next year, the Bulls can get another top 5 pick. Isiah is the man.

[cjg11582]

I am inclined to believe they would. Between Frye, Crawford, Sweetney and Rose you are not losing that much from Odom, Brown, Mihim and Parker. In addition The Knicks are in the much weaker conference and division.
The determining factor would be Larry Brown, if the two of the five biggest egos in The NBA could coexist like Phil and Kobe.

[EmpireWF]

I'm in the same mindset as CJG. Placing Kobe on the Knicks, it wouldn't be much different than the Lakers. And they're in the playoffs...granted they won't be going far but still.

CJG...Sweetney is on the Bulls. He was part of the Curry trade.

[cjg11582]

Good call, I meant Curry. the two are interchangeable anyways.

[EmpireWF]

LOL, pretty much. The problem with Curry is he just has ZERO desire to improve. He has the abilities to be one of the best big men in the league but he just doesn't care and doesn't want to be. It's so frustrating to have a guy like that on the team.

[cjg11582]

That seems to be the overriding theme with The current batch of Knicks, either they have no intention of improving their game or they are unaware of how to go about it. This current trend obviously isn't resonating well with the fans either. I was in NYC for The Big East tournament, Their were people trying to trade scalpers their Knicks tickets for Big East semifinal and finals tickets. Needless to say they seemed a little less than indispensible.
I make exceptions for the two rookies Robinson and Frye. But Robinson has a limited ceiling (plus he is competing with approximately 37 teammates who serve the same exact purpose on the court) as a result of his size and Frye is stuck in a guard oriented system.

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by EmpireWF

I'm in the same mindset as CJG. Placing Kobe on the Knicks, it wouldn't be much different than the Lakers. And they're in the playoffs...granted they won't be going far but still.

CJG...Sweetney is on the Bulls. He was part of the Curry trade.

Go ahead and dream that dream there Empire...the problem though is not the talent of the cast...its more team chemistry and management...and Kobe would not help either...

[cjg11582]

Well acquiring Kobe would reflect good team management, so you would attribute sixty losses solely to team chemistry? And if talent is not an issue, you are inferring that Marbury, Francis, Crawford etc. are as productive as Kobe would be? Really?
Teams that lose sixty games always have poor team chemistry. Always. But that is never the sole reason the win only 25% of their games. There are even a couple teams in the playoffs this year with bad chemistry (The Lakers and Nuggets come too mind) that were able to overcome it because of an excess of talent (Yes, Kobe does compensate for the rest of the team to warrant the phrasing "excess"). But teams with talent and bad chemistry (Seattle, Houston, Philly, Golden State) are not nearly as uninspiring as The Knicks. Too lose sixty games requires poor coaching, poor talent, poor management and poor chemistry.

[MJHMarc]

Well there is two problems with the Marbury for Kobe scenario.

A)Kobe Bryant has a no-trade clause in his contract
B)

New York Daily News - According to New York Daily News writer Frank Isola, the Knicks may have a taker for 'Starbury' after all.

Timberwolves owner Glen Taylor told the Minneapolis Star-Tribune on Wednesday that his team is interested in acquiring Stephon Marbury, whom Minnesota drafted 10 years ago and traded to the Nets in 1999. However, Taylor admitted that Marbury's contract - he'll earn $60 million over the next three seasons - is a major stumbling block.

Read more at http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archiv..._to_minnesota/

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by cjg11582

Well acquiring Kobe would reflect good team management, so you would attribute sixty losses solely to team chemistry? And if talent is not an issue, you are inferring that Marbury, Francis, Crawford etc. are as productive as Kobe would be? Really?
Teams that lose sixty games always have poor team chemistry. Always. But that is never the sole reason the win only 25% of their games. There are even a couple teams in the playoffs this year with bad chemistry (The Lakers and Nuggets come too mind) that were able to overcome it because of an excess of talent (Yes, Kobe does compensate for the rest of the team to warrant the phrasing "excess"). But teams with talent and bad chemistry (Seattle, Houston, Philly, Golden State) are not nearly as uninspiring as The Knicks. Too lose sixty games requires poor coaching, poor talent, poor management and poor chemistry.

Aaah come on down from that tall, tall, tall soap box before you fall down and hurt yourself CJG...Teams that lose sixty games doen't always have poor chemistry, some flat out lack talent...I am not inferring anything...I am flat out saying that Mabury, Crawford and company have plenty of upside and given a different setting can shine...there are plenty of teams that would take the talents the Knicks have...they waaay under acheived because of chemisty and management...

And getting Kobe is only a smart Managerial move, if you do not mortgage your entire future for the man, but given Thomas' track record, I would not count on it...so don't count your super hypothetical trades before Mr. Thomas has his day and leaves you shaking your head...

The Lakers and Nuggets might have bad chemistry all they want, but they do not have the coaching and management that the Knicks had...if they did, mighty Kobe (whom I actually like) would not have lifted the team anywhere on his own...

And given the Knicks season, Kobe for all his glory would have been one hated addition...he would have shot...the rest of the team would of sulked and watched, and they would still have lost...only Kobe would have had a scoring title...that is, if his teamates and Brown would have let him take +30 shots a game...

Now, go put away your soap box before you jump on it again and make assumptions on my part...

[cjg11582]

Well if you can name a single playoff series that Marbury, Crawford, Francis, Curry or any of those rookies have won, then I will adhere to your argument that any two of them are just as good as Kobe. Otherwise, I have to believe replacing any combination of the two with Kobe would be a significant improvement. They certainly wouldn't be holding the top lottery spot which they must forfeit to The Bulls.

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by cjg11582

Well if you can name a single playoff series that Marbury, Crawford, Francis, Curry or any of those rookies have won, then I will adhere to your argument that any two of them are just as good as Kobe. Otherwise, I have to believe replacing any combination of the two with Kobe would be a significant improvement. They certainly wouldn't be holding the top lottery spot which they must forfeit to The Bulls.

Like I said, that is but a small hypothetical piece of the puzzle...it by no means addresses the potential of the players they have...nor takes into account what they have to give up to get Kobe...or that the Knick's front office won't blunder the trade by giving up the rest of the pieces...

And my argument is not that any two are better than Kobe...my argument is that Kobe alone won't get them into the playoff...

PS Btw, since when was the playoff a measure of individual talent and not team effort?...you may indeed have talented players...and miss the playoffs...they are mutually exclusive items...

[cjg11582]

A playoff birth is a measure of collective individual talents, thats why adding Kobe to this team would vastly improve The Knicks standing. And to say they are mutually exclusive isn't applicable, one is a direct reflection of the other. Every NBA team needs a minimum of talent to reach and succeed in the playoffs. You couldn't throw a high school team out there and expect them to win because they have good ball distribution.