[bob101]

I am decidely more for racing than about drivers. Drivers come and go. Good racing goes on forever.

I get irritated at the preshow and during the race talking about driver XXX doing whatever off the track. I really could care less about a drivers charities, him building a new home/shop or whatever.

In fact I find I enjoy racing more the less I know about the drivers. I make lots of local races (and not so local when traveling) and am finding lately I enjoy them a lot more than NASCAR races.

To me it's getting to the point of a soap opera or wrestling than about racing. I mean watch NASCAR commercials about the nationwide series and all they talk about is Joey Logana. To me the nationwide series needs promoting it's good racing which is honestly better on track lately more so than cup racing. Same can be said for truck racing.

Watching an ARCA race has turned out better racing in the top half of the field better than cup lately as well.

To me the best is show up at a local track or visit a track (here they are all almost always dirt) and just watch without knowing anyone. You'll find out how much more exciting racing is than watching some dodo tell you about it on TV and doing magic acts because they think you are "bored" of the real racing.

NASCAR has been and should be exciting enough without all the sideshow stuff that has slowly crept into it the last 3 decades.

[GrimlockAutobot]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

Maybe I'm just confused? You seem, to me anyway, to be sending a mixed message. First you say that you watch for "The show," i.e., the racing itself. Then you go on about watching "Your driver" battle from the back. What about if Junior has a terminal mechanical failure on the first lap and is out for the rest of the race. What is your enjoyment level then?

Inquiring minds wish to know.

My example was as follows: If a fan is just in it for the win, then when Junior tore up his car like that then they probably would've turned the race off knowing he probably wouldn't win in that case.

Not me. I kept watching because I wanted to see what kind of driver he was and what he would do with a torn-up racecar. IMO that is an example of a fan who isn't just in it for the win.

If he had a teminal mechanical failure, I'd keep watching. I'd like to see what the drivers at the back of the pack can do as well as the drivers who are in the hunt for the championship. (it doesn't matter to me if the drivers in the hunt win....I just like to see where they finish.)

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

What you and I are seeing in CTS must obviously be some sort of mass hypnotic illusion? Why, they've proved up in the Cup Series, where as everyone knows the real racing is done, that you can't have a close season finish without a ten race playoff where the points are artificially reset.

A season championship being decided on straight points won each race? Now, I ask you, how "fair" and how exciting could THAT be?

Yes, you might have denoted a tiny bit of sarcasm in the above.

Went to my local track last night but on the DVR it looked as though Johnny B. was on a mission last night. I'm puzzled as to why Crissy was angry at another driver. It looked as thoug she just lost side draft. Good race, but then most races at Kentucky are.

I didn't see the race, but my son was watching and he told me the other driver (here the memory cell has faulted .. again .. but I seem to remember his saying it was Mike Wallace .. Crissy's dad!) wrecked her and that up to that point she wasn't backing down on anything and was doing a good job of moving her car thru the pack .. cleanly. Of course, I haven't substantiated my son's claim, so I'm only repeating what I remember of our conversation.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by bob101

I am decidely more for racing than about drivers. Drivers come and go. Good racing goes on forever.

I get irritated at the preshow and during the race talking about driver XXX doing whatever off the track. I really could care less about a drivers charities, him building a new home/shop or whatever.

In fact I find I enjoy racing more the less I know about the drivers. I make lots of local races (and not so local when traveling) and am finding lately I enjoy them a lot more than NASCAR races.

To me it's getting to the point of a soap opera or wrestling than about racing. I mean watch NASCAR commercials about the nationwide series and all they talk about is Joey Logana. To me the nationwide series needs promoting it's good racing which is honestly better on track lately more so than cup racing. Same can be said for truck racing.

Watching an ARCA race has turned out better racing in the top half of the field better than cup lately as well.

To me the best is show up at a local track or visit a track (here they are all almost always dirt) and just watch without knowing anyone. You'll find out how much more exciting racing is than watching some dodo tell you about it on TV and doing magic acts because they think you are "bored" of the real racing.

NASCAR has been and should be exciting enough without all the sideshow stuff that has slowly crept into it the last 3 decades.

I read, re-read and then read again. I couldn't find a single, solitary thing I disagree with. I wish that they could bottle your above and then give it to some of these newer fans for nourishment.

You wrote the following: "In fact I find I enjoy racing more the less I know about the drivers." Great observation!

In reflection I find that I enjoyed NASCAR much, much more back when they televised only a third of the races, when they didn't have 24/7 media coverage and when everyone (probably especially me) hadn't been turned from a race fan to a race critic.

This last paragraph will probably leave a lot of the new fans scratching their heads but I think you, and several others here will understand what I'm saying.

Thanks for the great post. It was needed.

[jks812]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

I didn't see the race, but my son was watching and he told me the other driver (here the memory cell has faulted .. again .. but I seem to remember his saying it was Mike Wallace .. Crissy's dad!) wrecked her and that up to that point she wasn't backing down on anything and was doing a good job of moving her car thru the pack .. cleanly. Of course, I haven't substantiated my son's claim, so I'm only repeating what I remember of our conversation.

It was Jack Sprague. His truck was crap and wasn't doing good, and he kept pinching her down every time she tried to pass him. She finally wrecked. But your son's right, up til then she was doing pretty good. She was really racing, not just riding. Guess Sprague didn't want to get out done by a girl. JK

[jks812]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

I didn't see the race, but my son was watching and he told me the other driver (here the memory cell has faulted .. again .. but I seem to remember his saying it was Mike Wallace .. Crissy's dad!) wrecked her and that up to that point she wasn't backing down on anything and was doing a good job of moving her car thru the pack .. cleanly. Of course, I haven't substantiated my son's claim, so I'm only repeating what I remember of our conversation.

And a side note on Chrissy. She's really been paying attention to Tony teaching her. She didn't bite her tongue during her interview when she said what happened and who it was.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by GrimlockAutobot

My example was as follows: If a fan is just in it for the win, then when Junior tore up his car like that then they probably would've turned the race off knowing he probably wouldn't win in that case.

Not me. I kept watching because I wanted to see what kind of driver he was and what he would do with a torn-up racecar. IMO that is an example of a fan who isn't just in it for the win.

If he had a teminal mechanical failure, I'd keep watching. I'd like to see what the drivers at the back of the pack can do as well as the drivers who are in the hunt for the championship. (it doesn't matter to me if the drivers in the hunt win....I just like to see where they finish.)

OK. I'm not confused anymore. We are a far distance apart as to why we watch stock car racing. Case closed.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by jks812

It was Jack Sprague. His truck was crap and wasn't doing good, and he kept pinching her down every time she tried to pass him. She finally wrecked. But your son's right, up til then she was doing pretty good. She was really racing, not just riding. Guess Sprague didn't want to get out done by a girl. JK

you're right! now the old memory cell finally fired and I remember the rest of the conversation (my apologies to daddy Mike .. got my wires crossed again.) seems Sprague was also down 2 laps while Chrissy was fighting to stay on the lead lap. I've never liked Sprague .. what he did is typical of the way he drives.

Originally Posted by jks812

And a side note on Chrissy. She's really been paying attention to Tony teaching her. She didn't bite her tongue during her interview when she said what happened and who it was.

yeah, that was the other thing my son said. she just laid it out in plain english so everyone could understand he just wrecked her for no other reason than he could (well, maybe with a large amount of jealousy thrown in .)

[PenelopePitStop]

I'm lovin', lovin' the opinions in this Thread.

I'll probably get my butt kicked for this one, but here's a secret: I started out as the worst fan of all.

When I was first introduced to Cup by my "spousal equivalent" at the time ('85), I couldn't keep track of the drivers at all. So I picked out cars based on their paint job. Yup, paint job! Knew the 3 because my SE told me to pay attention to him ... don't remember if it was still Wrangler or Goodwrench at the time. Liked the Texaco car ... still do, but hate the driver. Knew the Miller car, the Folgers car, and whatever car Bill Elliott was driving at the time (Coors?), and a few others. It's hard for a new fan to get a grip on the sport and the drivers.

Of course, over the years, I learned a lot. Paint jobs don't matter to me anymore. Talent and personality does.

As for other sports, I'm following the Sox more than ever. Do I want them to win? Absolutely! But I love the game. Same goes for Cup. Sure, there are certain drivers that I like to see win or fight their way from the back, but it's the show that I enjoy most, not the win.

I'm ducking ...

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

I'm lovin', lovin' the opinions in this Thread.

I'll probably get my butt kicked for this one, but here's a secret: I started out as the worst fan of all.

When I was first introduced to Cup by my "spousal equivalent" at the time ('85), I couldn't keep track of the drivers at all. So I picked out cars based on their paint job. Yup, paint job! Knew the 3 because my SE told me to pay attention to him ... don't remember if it was still Wrangler or Goodwrench at the time. Liked the Texaco car ... still do, but hate the driver. Knew the Miller car, the Folgers car, and whatever car Bill Elliott was driving at the time (Coors?), and a few others. It's hard for a new fan to get a grip on the sport and the drivers.

Of course, over the years, I learned a lot. Paint jobs don't matter to me anymore. Talent and personality does.

As for other sports, I'm following the Sox more than ever. Do I want them to win? Absolutely! But I love the game. Same goes for Cup. Sure, there are certain drivers that I like to see win or fight their way from the back, but it's the show that I enjoy most, not the win.

I'm ducking ...

I'm gonna have to disagree with you, Penny.

The worst fan of all isn't the one who goes for the most attractive paint jobs. Why do you think they spend so much time and effort to have a killer paint job? The answer is "to attract fans". And that's exactly what I look at when I watch a race that I don't know the competitors. I probably won't root for the pink car, or the one that makes my teeth hurt to look at it. And if it looks like a junker, it's lost my vote also. But there'll be at least one car that "looks good" to me, and that's usually my "first love" in that race .. until the driver does something stupid. Then after I watch the race for a few laps I begin seeing which drivers are serious about winning, which ones are talented, and which ones are wrecks waiting to happen, and I often will change my selection.

I never much cared for DW, but I always liked his paint jobs. In fact, the paint schemes on our Late Model and Super Late Model are based off his Western Auto cars.

The main point is that, over time, you've gotten more educated about the sport and have developed a different criteria for selecting your favorites. But I'd bet you still have favorite paint jobs, no matter who the driver is .. I know I do.

So no reason to fear the Noid twins. You're just like a lot of other fans, including me. (However, if you don't want to be like anyone else then you should use some other criteria for selecting your fav.) It doesn't matter who or what we root for, just that we root.

[TroubleTurnThree]

I thought I was torn between the win/the show, but now that I've really thought about it, I'm not. I watch first and foremost for the show.

Don't get me wrong, I have disturbed the neighbors more then once when a certain driver takes the checkered flag. But even when he's out (or many laps down) I still watch, still get excited, still (most of the time) wish I was there to witness the whole spectacle.

I share the opinion of many who can't stand the pre-race show, too. It feels like the producers are telling me I should care about this, and that, and the other...when really all I want is to witness the race. I still get that anxious/hopeful feeling as I watch the pace car pull off and see 43 cars take the green flag.

Who will it be today? What crazy/bold/breathtaking moves will I get to talk about with my racing buddies tomorrow? Ah, already I can't wait for this Sunday! I'm getting off work just in time to see the green flag. No pre-race for me...just the Brickyard.

BTW: I have been a lurker for some time and finally decided to join. This is by far the best NASCAR forum I have found. The people are passionate and intelligent and I have learned so much already. So thanks to everyone for making this place what it is!

[GrimlockAutobot]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

I'm lovin', lovin' the opinions in this Thread.

I'll probably get my butt kicked for this one, but here's a secret: I started out as the worst fan of all.

When I was first introduced to Cup by my "spousal equivalent" at the time ('85), I couldn't keep track of the drivers at all. So I picked out cars based on their paint job. Yup, paint job! Knew the 3 because my SE told me to pay attention to him ... don't remember if it was still Wrangler or Goodwrench at the time. Liked the Texaco car ... still do, but hate the driver. Knew the Miller car, the Folgers car, and whatever car Bill Elliott was driving at the time (Coors?), and a few others. It's hard for a new fan to get a grip on the sport and the drivers.

Of course, over the years, I learned a lot. Paint jobs don't matter to me anymore. Talent and personality does.

As for other sports, I'm following the Sox more than ever. Do I want them to win? Absolutely! But I love the game. Same goes for Cup. Sure, there are certain drivers that I like to see win or fight their way from the back, but it's the show that I enjoy most, not the win.

I'm ducking ...

I too am a Sox fan but, I prefer the White variety not the Red. I DO NOT mean any disrespect when I post this next statement: But, where I come from, the Red Sox are known as the "Sawx" imitating a New Englander's accent.

White Sox and Red Sox fans should be required to include the color in front of the word "Sox". That way it eliminates all of the confusion.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by TroubleTurnThree

I thought I was torn between the win/the show, but now that I've really thought about it, I'm not. I watch first and foremost for the show.

Don't get me wrong, I have disturbed the neighbors more then once when a certain driver takes the checkered flag. But even when he's out (or many laps down) I still watch, still get excited, still (most of the time) wish I was there to witness the whole spectacle.

I share the opinion of many who can't stand the pre-race show, too. It feels like the producers are telling me I should care about this, and that, and the other...when really all I want is to witness the race. I still get that anxious/hopeful feeling as I watch the pace car pull off and see 43 cars take the green flag.

Who will it be today? What crazy/bold/breathtaking moves will I get to talk about with my racing buddies tomorrow? Ah, already I can't wait for this Sunday! I'm getting off work just in time to see the green flag. No pre-race for me...just the Brickyard.

BTW: I have been a lurker for some time and finally decided to join. This is by far the best NASCAR forum I have found. The people are passionate and intelligent and I have learned so much already. So thanks to everyone for making this place what it is!

Hey TroubleTurnThree (mind if I call you "TTT"? my keyboard is getting old and it gets tired easily?), Welcome to GoTeamsGo and the NASCAR forums. From reading your post I think you'll fit in just fine here. We'll probably find a way to weedle the info out of you about that "certain" driver, but we'll let you slide for now.

Make sure you stop by the "predictions" thread and post yours. Who knows, you may win! All the info on what the prizes are are in the thread. And there's a live chat during the race if you're into that.

Also, if you're into other forms of motorsports, i.e., anything not NASCAR, stop over there too. Again, welcome.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by GrimlockAutobot

I too am a Sox fan but, I prefer the White variety not the Red. I DO NOT mean any disrespect when I post this next statement: But, where I come from, the Red Sox are known as the "Sawx" imitating a New Englander's accent.

White Sox and Red Sox fans should be required to include the color in front of the word "Sox". That way it eliminates all of the confusion.

How about the fans of the Red ones just call ourselves "Champs" instead ??? I like it.

[GrimlockAutobot]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

How about the fans of the Red ones just call ourselves "Champs" instead ??? I like it.

Ha Ha Ha very funny. We were Champs too not that long ago. At least we're not the Cubs.....OK back NASCAR discussion.