[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by wingkey1

Duke Lacrosse

Mike Nifong

************************************

Will be interesting to see whether any parallels might be drawn when all of this finally plays out / comes to light.

The former had elements of prejudgement that were, at the very least, disappointing. Hopefully it proved enlightening to some.

Sad events in any case.

THANK YOU, WING!!!

The Equal Protection Clause, part of the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, provides that "no state shall… deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." The Equal Protection Clause can be seen as an attempt to secure the promise of the United States' professed commitment to the proposition that "all men are created equal" by empowering the judiciary to enforce that principle against the states.

The Duke Lacrosse Team fiasco proved the above, which is the right of every American citizen, proved that it doesn't exist in matters of alleged sexual harassment. It would seem that any lawsuit brought about with either sex or gender or race as a qualifier, the accused is considered guilty until proven innocent.

The bimbo who brought the charges in the Duke case remained anonymous but the accused had their names and pictures plastered all over the media and their reputations were effectively damaged and, in a couple of cases, ruined.

This whole thing, brought about by Ms. Grant is, to me, just so much effort to attract attention and to become rich on someone else's dime ($250 million? Give me a break!) until proven otherwise.

Sorry Space, jks, and all you other good girls out there. There are a lot of male jerks out there who need a good horsewhipping, for their treatment of females. But, there are, for my perspective, more females who knowingly place themselves in a male environment then whine, complain and sue when males continue to act like males. I mean no disrespect to you but...

The stripper at Duke soured me on all matters like this.

[PenelopePitStop]

Oh, boy! What a Thread.

If, and that's a big "if", the claims are true, I have to believe that the $250M figure comes from the lawyer. That is a CRAZY amount of money. She'll never win.

Don't get me wrong. Discrimination and sexual harassment are alive and well, but this just seems to be a bit much. If I sued every time someone was "inappropriate", I'd be rich and living on a tropical island with a personal cabana boy!

[Racer Duck]

Unfortunately this "validates" the opinion of many who think NASCAR is a "redneck" sport and nothing more.

I agree with kcoruol, there may be some wrongdoing, but this law suit "smells".

There are no claims she was physically nor sexually threatened (grounds for a criminal case), so the crux of the suit is her perception of the situation and the emotional harm it did to her which is also preventing her from getting another job.

Whatever happened, happened just before she was let go 'cause her performance wasn't affected, according to the lawsuit, until then. I'd bet her "emotional harm" could be assuaged for as little as maybe a couple year's salary .. but then her lawyers wouldn't get as much....

[BiscuitMan]

Originally Posted by Lefty Noob

According to the Associated Press, "A former racing official is suing NASCAR for $250 million, alleging racial and sexual discrimination, sexual harassment and wrongful termination... [former Nationwide Series inspector Mauricia] Grant alleged she was referred to as 'Nappy Headed Mo' and 'Queen Sheba,' by co-workers, was often told she worked on “colored people time,” and was frightened by one official who routinely made references to the Ku Klux Klan." She further alleges that co-worked has exposed themselves to her.

This issue made national news a couple years ago when Mauricia Grant filed an EEOC complaint about her work conditions as a NASCAR inspector. I don't know what the outcome was from the EEOC investigation.

When the EEOC Administrative Judge (AJ) issued a decision (either a dismissal, a summary judgment decision or a decision following a hearing), the agency should have taken final action on the complaint and issued a "final order" within 40 days. I don't know if that is public record or not. But my assumption is that this will be the basis for any civil action.

The final order must notify the complainant (Mauricia Grant) whether or not the agency will implement the decision of the AJ. The AJ will give notice of the complainant's right to appeal to EEOC or to file a civil action.

If she lost or the claim was dismissed (that would be my assumption) then she would have appealed the decision. If she lost in the appeal process this would be her only resort - to sue her employer for discrimination.

I don't think this is in any way a comparable case to the Duke Lacrosse case. It's strictly an employement issue that NASCAR has experienced.

It's unfortunate that this lawsuit has brought NASCAR to the front of the news with implications that they have not managed in a manner to prevent what is in the alligations by Mauricia Grant. In 2000 NASCAR announced their policy and commitment to bring diversity to their workforce so it would reflect the fabric of America. Well, maybe they have failed in that process.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

Oh, boy! What a Thread.

If, and that's a big "if", the claims are true, I have to believe that the $250M figure comes from the lawyer. That is a CRAZY amount of money. She'll never win.

Don't get me wrong. Discrimination and sexual harassment are alive and well, but this just seems to be a bit much. If I sued every time someone was "inappropriate", I'd be rich and living on a tropical island with a personal cabana boy!

...and a THANK YOU, Penny. Common sense, such as yours above, is becoming more and more a rarity.

I have a question but can't find the answer. Maybe you, or someone else here might direct me...

Just exactly where in our Constitution, does it spell out that Americans have a RIGHT to NOT be offended and are justified in asking legal redress for such offending?

Yeah, I'm sure some clod acted like a genuine dork with Ms. Grant. Yeah, I'm absolutely sure some idiot made her life unduly difficult in the workplace she chose to be in. I bet similar things have happened to everyone here, male or female. From what I read no assault or physical harm is being alleged.

My advice is: Grow up, get a set, and get the Hell over it!

From Shakespeare's Henry VI, part 2 (act 4, scene 2, in specific): "First kill all the lawyers."

[LSC9901]

My guess is they are looking for a quick settlement out of court. The number is way beyond insane. Make the number big enough and they'll offer something everyone can be happy with. One of my big complaints is that we only hear what they want us to hear. What is the real story ?? NO I mean the REAL story ?? I'm not even implying that there isn't some wrongdoings that happened here, but exactly what were they ???

[clutch]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

My guess is they are looking for a quick settlement out of court. The number is way beyond insane. Make the number big enough and they'll offer something everyone can be happy with. One of my big complaints is that we only hear what they want us to hear. What is the real story ?? NO I mean the REAL story ?? I'm not even implying that there isn't some wrongdoings that happened here, but exactly what were they ???

Story or facts......here is the file

http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/story/8229358


But apparently this woman never complained to her supervisor about these complaints when they alledgedly occured.????

Sorry SC and jks.......but looks alot like many, many other cases which many of us are growing tired of

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

My guess is they are looking for a quick settlement out of court. The number is way beyond insane. Make the number big enough and they'll offer something everyone can be happy with. One of my big complaints is that we only hear what they want us to hear. What is the real story ?? NO I mean the REAL story ?? I'm not even implying that there isn't some wrongdoings that happened here, but exactly what were they ???

For what it might, or might not be worth, the following if from the AP:
UPDATE: NASCAR chairman Brian France says a former official who's suing the organization never reported discrimination or harassment claims to her supervisors. Mauricia Grant filed a $225 million suit against NASCAR on Tuesday, alleging racial discrimination, sexual harassment and retaliatory termination. France said Wednesday the detailed filing was the first NASCAR learned of her claims. "The disappointing thing is she makes a lot of claims, none of them reported," he said.(Associated Press)(6-11-200 [/b]

I still think The Bard had it right. From Shakespeare's Henry VI, part 2 (act 4, scene 2, in specific): "First kill all the lawyers."

[kcoruol]

Sometimes these cases have merit and sometimes don't. Certainly when they don't the person bringing the case will ultimately make it more difficult to get a job.

If I was an employer who hired a red headed martian and then that martian turned around and sued the pants off of me because some body made green jokes, then I'd probably think twice before hiring another red headed martian especially if the first time I heard about these jokes was after the red headed martian got fired for not showing up for work or what ever reason.

First drugs, now discrimination, what's the next scandel to rock NAACAR? Betting?

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by kcoruol

Sometimes these cases have merit and sometimes don't. Certainly when they don't the person bringing the case will ultimately make it more difficult to get a job.

Solution. Change tort laws to reflect that when anyone brings suit in personal injury, harassment, defamation, etc., etc., and lose, they are responsible for all court cost, both for court itself and defendant.

Originally Posted by kcoruol

If I was an employer who hired a red headed martian and then that martian turned around and sued the pants off of me because some body made green jokes, then I'd probably think twice before hiring another red headed martian especially if the first time I heard about these jokes was after the red headed martian got fired for not showing up for work or what ever reason.

Plus, once they have status, you can't fire them without fear of a "bias" law suit.

Originally Posted by kcoruol

First drugs, now discrimination, what's the next scandel to rock NAACAR? Betting?

How about another J.T. Hayes type of scandal? We could discuss THAT for the rest of the season!

[wingkey1]

Fun string. More fun -

“don't think this is in any way a comparable case to the Duke Lacrosse case. It's strictly an employment issue that NASCAR has experienced” – might not some see the Duke/Lacrosse thing at the very least starting out as an “employment” which led to an “issue” raised on the part of the employee relative to intended versus perceived elements of performance required during the period of employment?

“In 2000 NASCAR announced their policy and commitment to bring diversity to their workforce so it would reflect the fabric of America. Well, maybe they have failed in that process” – and the truly unfortunate aspect of this is that some (more and more?), just as in the Duke event, will tend to “heap on” towards the “guilty until proven innocent” view. Particularly against the larger entity in the case/allegation. Incredible. It is these some who make those in the profession of Law rich. It is these some who are sought out in the Jury selection process by the representative of the claimant/plaintiff. Ugly stuff. “Back in the USSR boy, ya don’t know how lucky you are boy”. Ugh!

I'd be rich and living on a tropical island with a personal cabana boy! – and for the “sensitive” this may be hurtfully seen as a capitalistic/opportunistic discriminatory viewpoint with shades of that which ‘ol Abe sought to abolish

Unfortunately this "validates" the opinion of many who think NASCAR is a "redneck" sport and nothing more – and this crowd might also see Duke University and Lacrosse as “redneck”. Now understanding (?) a mentality (?) that would be inclined to irrevocably equate “South of Mason Dixon” as “redneck” without question ---- Ahhhhh. Well ----- Ahh. My kinda humans(?).

What is the real story ?? NO I mean the REAL story ?? I'm not even implying that there isn't some wrongdoings that happened here, but exactly what were they ??? – Unfortunately, this ain’t the stuff of headlines. Anybody seen Jesse or Al?

When did America become such whinner's and victims? – when doing nothing resulted in pay for performance at the nothing level. When it was clear the bleeding hearts had garnered enough attention that awards for lack of personal integrity, responsibility, and accountability increasingly resulted in leniencies approaching guaranteed lifetime annuities. When increasingly the cry was for the Big Talking Head to “do something”. Not totally unlike – “When’s NASCAR going to do something?” A sign of the times.

David Duke was fired within the past six weeks – Ahhhh. Nah, can’t be. But hey, it’s right out of the article. I wanna play medidiot – NASCAR admits to employing David Duke. Duke now seen as part of discriminatory claims on the part of a former NASCAR employee and official. NASCAR official claims Duke was released after repeated allegations from hotels on the circuit that bed sheet theft notably increased on race weekends in their geography – now if that headline don’t flat destroy Brian by inciting the “believe all” lemmings, nothing will.

“--- say there is a pitcrew member who is mooslum and it's time to pray” – watch closely. Time may not be all that far away when televised pre-race prayer ceases, or it at the very least will no longer be allowed that the pre-race prayer in any way contains a Christian reference. Like the other major US sports, still later will come the “not enough time to televise the National Anthem”. Mark the words. Line up for you permanent admissions tattoo. Sick, sick, sick (or something that sounded that way).

“How do you know when your belly's too big? ----- I can't believe the ambulance teams aren't hauling the NASCAR officials off for heart attacks” – to the initial question, when NASCAR hires you away from the NYPD

“That article was not about this woman's performance” – and what is coming to light as more about the case comes out, the proverbial “straw” was when someone is alleged to have removed the “r” from her GM Goodwrench shirts and jackets.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

How about another J.T. Hayes type of scandal? We could discuss THAT for the rest of the season!

That one is interesting to say the least.

[jks812]

Originally Posted by clutch

Sorry SC and jks.......but looks alot like many, many other cases which many of us are growing tired of

I didn't say she was telling the truth. Just that I wouldn't say anything about her until it was discovered if she was telling the truth or not. But believe me, when women say this crap and it ends up not being true, that really pisses me off. People like that is the reason my daughter wasn't believed.
I am a firm believer that when a female does this and it proves that she's lying, she should be sent to jail.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

That one is interesting to say the least.

There are many here that weren't around a year and a half ago when we first broached this subject. They are probably unfamiliar with the J.T. Hayes saga. I'll include some links.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terri_O'Connell

The Life of J.T. Hayes/Terry O'Connell

I REALLY wonder just how NA__AR would handle the problem today? I think that it'd be a hoot.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

There are many here that weren't around a year and a half ago when we first broached this subject. They are probably unfamiliar with the J.T. Hayes saga. I'll include some links.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terri_O'Connell

The Life of J.T. Hayes/Terry O'Connell

I REALLY wonder just how NA__AR would handle the problem today? I think that it'd be a hoot.

I suspect they would have no choice but to "Embrace" the challenge !!!