[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bette

Bear with me. I'm trying to work my way through this. LSC said he hoped Moss would just be a background owner. So were the people you named above not background owners and that's why they failed? You implied you needed a history of racing. What about Joe Gibbs? What does he do anyway? Owner or what? Is he successful? Did he have a previous racing background before he got into it?

By background owner I mean just put up some cash and never be seen. As Bob noted most high profile owners from other venues are seldom successful. Joe Gibbs is the one in a million. He has a very successful operation and is at times quite visible to the public. When he returned to football his son took over and there was some hate and discontent among the teams. He is now back and things are somewhat smooth. Rumor has it that Tony Stewart wants out to get into the ownership side of the business and possibly still drive.

Terry Bradshaw spent 5 years as a part owner of a Busch series team (lower level NASCAR) but ended up getting out due to other commitments mainly in the broadcast industry.

I have no idea if Randy has any racing background and if he does it isn't very well known to the general public. Anything I've read merely says he's looking for something to do after football. I'm not sure that NASCAR racing is something to do after you finish one career with no real background in it. How would it be if Jeff Gordon went into baseball after his career in auto racing ???? Really makes little sense. It is entirely possible that Randy can come into the sport and make good but the odds are against him.

[Labontefan15]

I hope the team has some success even though i'm not a Randy Moss fan

[jks812]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

How would it be if Jeff Gordon went into baseball after his career in auto racing ???? Really makes little sense. It is entirely possible that Randy can come into the sport and make good but the odds are against him.

I think if Jeff has the money to hire the right people, he could own a baseball team. Just like if Moss uses his head he'll hire the right people to run the team for him. I'm not sure he should jump in there and try to do it himself when it first starts up.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by jks812

I think if Jeff has the money to hire the right people, he could own a baseball team. Just like if Moss uses his head he'll hire the right people to run the team for him. I'm not sure he should jump in there and try to do it himself when it first starts up.

Basically what I was saying. Throw all the money you want at it but let those that know what they are doing, do it.

[jks812]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

Basically what I was saying. Throw all the money you want at it but let those that know what they are doing, do it.

If he does that he might have a chance. But I'm like you, if he tries to do it, I don't think it'll go very far. But maybe he'll surprise us and do really good.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Bette

Bear with me. I'm trying to work my way through this. LSC said he hoped Moss would just be a background owner. So were the people you named above not background owners and that's why they failed? You implied you needed a history of racing. What about Joe Gibbs? What does he do anyway? Owner or what? Is he successful? Did he have a previous racing background before he got into it?

I fully see your point and based on the statement above I understand your questioning my belief.

Why did they fail? I don't claim to know for sure but all the above except Brad Daugherty and Joe Gibbs all had one thing in common; virtually no history in the sport of racing and one would be lead to believe, very little personal interest in the sport. (OK, Terry Bradshaw made a movie where some sort of racing was involved, but I don't count that as a "history in racing.")

Why would someone who knows little about racing want to start a team?
(1) They see a chance to make money? (This is basically BS, IRT a neophyte car owner. As Duck, who IS a late model car owner will verify I'm sure, one of the quickest ways to make a small fortune is to start with a large fortune and start a racing team)
(2) They do it for PR and another way to gain headlines?
(3) They are taken by the personalities in NA__AR and want to rub shoulders with people involved in the sport, and have the financial wherewithal to do so?
(4) They're crooks and are working a scam? (Remember the chick 4 or 5 years ago who "started a BGN team," hired Harold Holly as Crew Chief, Mike McLaughlin as driver, bought two turn key Daytona cars, collected a few million in up front sponsor money, then the day BGN practice started she disappeared with the sponsor's money and was last heard of living very well in... France or Belgium, I believe. It happens)

I have a basic more I go by: No one ever was disappointed overestimating the motives of his fellow humans. Based on that I respectfully remain very leery of non-racing people becoming financially involved in team ownership.

Aren't you glad the world isn't made up of yahoos like me? <g>

[Bette]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

I fully see your point and based on the statement above I understand your questioning my belief.

Why did they fail? I don't claim to know for sure but all the above except Brad Daugherty and Joe Gibbs all had one thing in common; virtually no history in the sport of racing and one would be lead to believe, very little personal interest in the sport. (OK, Terry Bradshaw made a movie where some sort of racing was involved, but I don't count that as a "history in racing.")

Why would someone who knows little about racing want to start a team?
(1) They see a chance to make money? (This is basically BS, IRT a neophyte car owner. As Duck, who IS a late model car owner will verify I'm sure, one of the quickest ways to make a small fortune is to start with a large fortune and start a racing team)
(2) They do it for PR and another way to gain headlines?
(3) They are taken by the personalities in NA__AR and want to rub shoulders with people involved in the sport, and have the financial wherewithal to do so?
(4) They're crooks and are working a scam? (Remember the chick 4 or 5 years ago who "started a BGN team," hired Harold Holly as Crew Chief, Mike McLaughlin as driver, bought two turn key Daytona cars, collected a few million in up front sponsor money, then the day BGN practice started she disappeared with the sponsor's money and was last heard of living very well in... France or Belgium, I believe. It happens)

I have a basic more I go by: No one ever was disappointed overestimating the motives of his fellow humans. Based on that I respectfully remain very leery of non-racing people becoming financially involved in team ownership.

Aren't you glad the world isn't made up of yahoos like me? <g>

I know at least two yahoos now.
I kind of like the one who disappeared with the sponsor's money to go live in France or something.
If you are like Duck, you are doing it for the love of the sport. But with these NFL guys its like, HMM guess I will go start a racing team.
I didnt think anyone did it for the money. Its like racing is the latest place to see and be seen.
How does this affect the sport in general?

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Bette

I know at least two yahoos now.
I kind of like the one who disappeared with the sponsor's money to go live in France or something.
If you are like Duck, you are doing it for the love of the sport. But with these NFL guys its like, HMM guess I will go start a racing team.
I didnt think anyone did it for the money. Its like racing is the latest place to see and be seen.
How does this affect the sport in general?

People didn't use to get into it for the money, Bette. Prior to 1987 (I'm just picking that year because I feel most of NA__AR's current ills began then, but 1948, 1955, 1969, 1972 and 1984 would also serve just as well) people "got into the sport because they followed it and wanted just to be part of it.

Sadly, those innocent days are behind us. Look and Mikey's team.

He's backed by financier Robert Kauffman. Believe me, those people do not do anything involving money "for fun!"

If you believe George Gillette got involved with Ray Evernham solely because he loves auto racing I have this bridge in Brooklyn I'll give you a decent price on. He bought out Ray because he collects profitable sports franchises.


How does all this affect the sport in general? I guess it depends upon your point of view. Speaking ONLY from my position it affects NA__AR about like Caster Oil affects your digestive system. My mother used to tell me that it was good for me, but if it was so good for me why did it make me spend so much time on the commode?

[Bette]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

People didn't use to get into it for the money, Bette. Prior to 1987 (I'm just picking that year because I feel most of NA__AR's current ills began then, but 1948, 1955, 1969, 1972 and 1984 would also serve just as well) people "got into the sport because they followed it and wanted just to be part of it.

Sadly, those innocent days are behind us. Look and Mikey's team.

He's backed by financier Robert Kauffman. Believe me, those people do not do anything involving money "for fun!"

If you believe George Gillette got involved with Ray Evernham solely because he loves auto racing I have this bridge in Brooklyn I'll give you a decent price on. He bought out Ray because he collects profitable sports franchises.


How does all this affect the sport in general? I guess it depends upon your point of view. Speaking ONLY from my position it affects NA__AR about like Caster Oil affects your digestive system. My mother used to tell me that it was good for me, but if it was so good for me why did it make me spend so much time on the commode?

Whoa you are confusing me Bob. If Duck lost a big fortune to make a small fortune then why did Gilette buy out Ray because he collects profitable sports franchises. You made it sound like its not that profitable.
Sorry for being an idiot. I have this funny habit of trying to nail down the small details before I can handle the big ones. I'll get it sooner or later, although LSC will say probably later.
Would it be fair to say that maybe the owners are in it for the love of the sport less than the drivers and teams and such?
My non sports loving husband says there isnt anything as sports anymore. Its all about money. Looks like maybe the bug has hit Nascar too.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Bette

Whoa you are confusing me Bob. If Duck lost a big fortune to make a small fortune then why did Gilette buy out Ray because he collects profitable sports franchises. You made it sound like its not that profitable. .

My bad. I NEVER MEANT TO INFER THAT DUCK LOST A FORTUNE IN HIS RACING ENDEAVOURS!!! Sorry Ducky. I was just using you as a method of verification.

The difference between Charlie and Randy Mossy, or whatever his name is, is that Duck has lots of prior knowledge about racing. Getting into racing at any kind of ownership level is kind of like trading stocks. IF you know the game you have a fighting chance, but if you're going in cold and as a way to "get rich quick," or "to hang around with d'boyz," you are the proverbial lamp going to the slaughter.

Most most is made off the sponsor deals, anyway. For example, Shrubby made a little over $324,000 for his Texas win. If you look at the cost of the car, his salary, operating costs, and asundry other costs, they would have lost money, based on his winnings.

The lower you go on the racing rungs, right down to the local street stock level, this difference gets greater and greater. But you probably already knew all this and I'm insulting your intelligence. But maybe some new folks here didn't realize this?

Originally Posted by Bette

Would it be fair to say that maybe the owners are in it for the love of the sport less than the drivers and teams and such?.

Roush, Rick Hendrick, Chip Ganassi and Roger Penske are exceptions. They love the sport and have long and personal ties to it. Same with Mikey and Ray Evernham. The investors and the Bobby Ginns of the sport... Hahahahahaha

Originally Posted by Bette

My non sports loving husband says there isn't anything as sports anymore. Its all about money. Looks like maybe the bug has hit Nascar too.

I believe your hubby and I could have a very friendly discussion over a few glasses of scotch and some fine cigars.

[Nevadastars]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

Staubach and Aiken pulled out.

Same thing with Dan Marino and Terry Bradshaw.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Nevadastars

Same thing with Dan Marino and Terry Bradshaw.

Yep.

With Bradshaw, I think he had some type of interest but it was never a passion. With Marino, Aiken Stabach, Joyner and several others it was a case of, "Gee, this might be kind of novel to be involved in, and I have the money so... Why not?"

I can't speak for you, Don but as far as I'm concerned, I just wish schlubs such as those above would just stay in their own yards and stay the Hell out of mine! If they don't have an inherent love of cars and racing then we have nothing to talk about!

[Bette]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

My bad. I NEVER MEANT TO INFER THAT DUCK LOST A FORTUNE IN HIS RACING ENDEAVOURS!!! Sorry Ducky. I was just using you as a method of verification.

But you probably already knew all this and I'm insulting your intelligence. But maybe some new folks here didn't realize this?


I believe your hubby and I could have a very friendly discussion over a few glasses of scotch and some fine cigars.

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

Yep.



I can't speak for you, Don but as far as I'm concerned, I just wish schlubs such as those above would just stay in their own yards and stay the Hell out of mine! If they don't have an inherent love of cars and racing then we have nothing to talk about!

Good thing you clarified about Ducky. I was just about to take up a collection for him.

about the intelligence LSC, do you see that? Bob assumes I have intelligence.

Hubbie neither drinks or smokes anymore.

Am I in trouble about the love of cars and racing thing? I really dont know enough about it to love it. Basically I am just nosy.

But I do appreciate your clarification on the subjects regardless of the rest of my comments here. Thank you.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bette

Good thing you clarified about Ducky. I was just about to take up a collection for him.

about the intelligence LSC, do you see that? Bob assumes I have intelligence.

Hubbie neither drinks or smokes anymore.

Am I in trouble about the love of cars and racing thing? I really dont know enough about it to love it. Basically I am just nosy.

But I do appreciate your clarification on the subjects regardless of the rest of my comments here. Thank you.

Bette .... no doubt you have heard the little ditty about "assume". Bob is a true gentleman and wouldn't throw you under the bus ..... yet !!!

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

Bette .... no doubt you have heard the little ditty about "assume". Bob is a true gentleman and wouldn't throw you under the bus ..... yet !!!

Never! At least to anyone who can use words of more than two syllables in coherent statements and doesn't appear here with the attitude: "I have a favourite driver and he is the reincarnation of Yahweh. All the other drivers are buffalo barf and deserve to burn in eternal damnation!," or attitudes about racing, tracks, etc., etc. which fall into that general category. I can think of only one or two recent posts which meet these criteria. Remembering the past couple years, the names: Bean, Bozo, Yelk, Deltonega and Pepsi One immediately come to mind.

Bette and others here put forth good positions which make me think. At my age, that is a good thing.