[Ellison]

Originally Posted by Bryan88

hmmm, I take it your not a JPM fan. Certainly he has not been perfect and is somewhat responsible for his rep, but he hasn't been nearly as bad as people have made him out to be. I don't have feelings either way on him, but he is very talented and in my opinion will be a chase contender this year.

I agree. I hope your right, I drafted him in my fantasy league.

Honestly, I had nothing but hatred for him after his hack move at Daytona but I don't consider myself for or against Pablo when it comes to the big picture.

I just think it's amazing Pablo fans would start a sarcastic thread like this and try to defend him after another one of his "graceful" moves caused another wreck. Not the best timing.

[loco4pablo]

Originally Posted by Ellison

who caused that Hamlin, Mears wreck?

that's right ... thought so.

The Pablo fans should wait for a race where he doesn't cause one before they pull out the soap box (I know it's tough, you'll be waiting a long time).

It's Bristol for god sakes... who doesn't hit something there? Believe me I would pick JPM over Mears any time, any track, any car. Mears is where in the points? Driving for who?

[LSC9901]

Yes it is Bristol and while the COT has made for better racing there are still plenty of wrecks. I think the tapes will verify that Harvick did in fact get off the track which did make him loose control. I feel bad that Tony was subdued in his response. saying that it was probably his fault looked more like a man who had been defeated one to many times. I got no love for Harvick. He is a walking attitude. I'm sure he'll never change. In my eyes he and JPM have similar issues. They both want to win and are willing to do it at any cost. Some fans are OK with that type of driving ... I am not. I don't care if you beat me, just don't wreck me. David Regan was/is a rolling wreck also but ...... (and this isn't the perfect excuse) he just makes major errors while JPM (in my view) is willing to move you for the sake of his finish. Ask Scott Pruett about it.

JPM seems better this year, so far, but the season is still young. I'm still a believer that you need to experience NASCAR at lower levels before you move up to the big leagues. Regan obviously didn't spend enough time there and it shows

[SteelPhoenyx]

Originally Posted by loco4pablo

It's Bristol for god sakes... who doesn't hit something there? Believe me I would pick JPM over Mears any time, any track, any car. Mears is where in the points? Driving for who?

And yet Harvick is claimed to be a menace because of hitting Stewart at Bristol.

Originally Posted by LSC9901

I'm still a believer that you need to experience NASCAR at lower levels before you move up to the big leagues.

I heartily agree... including ALL of the open wheelers... who should have spent at least a year in the Truck series, THEN Nationwide before their butts even got near the seat of a cup car.

[loco4pablo]

No I don't think Harvick is a menace at all... Like I said it's Bristol..And with less then 20 to go! it happens no big deal in my book

[NASCAR Gnome]

Originally Posted by Ellison

who caused that Hamlin, Mears wreck?

that's right ... thought so.

The Pablo fans should wait for a race where he doesn't cause one before they pull out the soap box (I know it's tough, you'll be waiting a long time).

I knew this would surface so...

One question: where did Hamlin finish? Despite the #42 and #11 getting together, didn't Hamlin come back and, with two laps to go in the race, take the outright race lead? Getting brushed by the #42 certainly didn't appear to compromise his ability to run up front now did it? So with that argument squashed, I guess the next thing I'll hear is that Montoya actually caused the #11 to RUN OUT OF GAS at the end there? C'mon now...

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by Ellison

I just think it's amazing Pablo fans would start a sarcastic thread like this and try to defend him after another one of his "graceful" moves caused another wreck. Not the best timing.

Thank you. I thought I was the only one who noticed that.

[disco stu]

To be fair to Harvick, I thought his post-race comments were very honest.

"I was going for the win and I just lost it (the car)"

You can't really say fairer than that, in my opinion.

He also made some comments regarding him and TS sorting it out between themselves despite the spotters stirring up trouble...which I didn't fully understand.

Was he suggesting that his spotter was blaming Tony for the coming together when, in fact, it was his own fault?

Or was he saying that Tony's spotter was trying to stir things up?

Or both?

Or none of the above?

I didn't understand what he meant.

Enlightenment would be greatly appreciated.

Ty

[oncea3fan]

yeah I heard the same comment about the spotter, but never heard anything more.


has far has the a JPM thing goes, it sound though as if as long has he does cause a leader to crash out then a bone head move is fine.
JPM I could take him or leave him.

[3fanforever]

Apparently, right after Kevin hit Tony, he told his spotter to go over to Tony's spotter and tell him what happened. When he got there, Tony's spotter told Kevin's spotter he was gonna whip somebody's butt, which upset both Kevin and his spotter...

“I told my spotter to go over and tell him what happened,” Harvick said. “The first thing his spotter did was commence into saying he was going to whip somebody's ass. If Tony didn't do it, he was going to do it."

“Tony and I are big boys. We can handle that. We don't need somebody who doesn't really have anything to do with anything [getting involved]. It really ticked me off. I'm to the point where I can talk about it. But when I got out of my car, I was more mad about that than I was anything.”

[disco stu]

Thanks for that 3fan.

Surely, though, at the end of the day what happened was simply a pretty typical of "racing accident".

Ie. two hugely competitive guys going b***s out for the win with very little time and distance left.

At this stage of the season there's no real need to be strategic points-wise is there?

Wins are what matter to real racers I think.

Or am I wrong?

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by disco stu

Thanks for that 3fan.

Surely, though, at the end of the day what happened was simply a pretty typical of "racing accident".

Ie. two hugely competitive guys going b***s out for the win with very little time and distance left.

At this stage of the season there's no real need to be strategic points-wise is there?

Wins are what matter to real racers I think.

Or am I wrong?

right you are stu. wins are the most important thing .. but not the only thing. (need to pay the bills too, you know!)

I guess to put into perspective, wins are 1st, best finish possible is 2nd, and keeping sponsors happy is 3rd.

making the Chase is a by product of 1 & 2 and goes a long way to satisfying 3.

bottom line: it's always the right time to worry about points if you're in it for the championship.

[disco stu]

You could also argue, though, that a last lap melee involving significant lingering close-ups and replays of your sponsors logo also satisifies 3.

What, I guess DOES NOT satisfy 3 is a mid-to-back-end grid position followed by an anonymous run to 32nd.

Do you think that the sponsors place a huge value on making the chase?

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by disco stu

You could also argue, though, that a last lap melee involving significant lingering close-ups and replays of your sponsors logo also satisifies 3.

What, I guess DOES NOT satisfy 3 is a mid-to-back-end grid position followed by an anonymous run to 32nd.

Do you think that the sponsors place a huge value on making the chase?

A sponsor is paying for a moving billboard on which to display their name/product. The more exposure they get, the better. So, I'll ask a counter question whose answer should help answer yours: How many cars/drivers that were talked about in the races leading up to the Chase and during the Chase do you remember that were not, nor had a chance to get into the Chase? Exposure is everything to a sponsor - some even relish bad exposure!

[BiscuitMan]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

A sponsor is paying for a moving billboard on which to display their name/product. The more exposure they get, the better. So, I'll ask a counter question whose answer should help answer yours: How many cars/drivers that were talked about in the races leading up to the Chase and during the Chase do you remember that were not, nor had a chance to get into the Chase? Exposure is everything to a sponsor - some even relish bad exposure!

I don't how many. But I did notice e past two weekends the FOX announcers referred to cars stating that (in Scott Riggs situation) that the sponsor would stay on that car for several race. However they never mention the sponsor's name and even in HD you could not ready the spomsor's name on the car.

The announcers used to refer to cars as the DuPont Chevy, Home Depot Chevy, Office Depot Ford etc. FOX tends to not give credit except if the yget something in return.