[BringBackWilkesboro]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

trivia time: back in '72 when my brother got his first cup ride he told me that the teams put talcum powder on the cars .. said it was a "speed secret" - the powder filled in the small cracks and indentions making the car more aerodynamic. he said that's the reason there's always a big cloud of dust on the start of a race .. all the talcum powder blowing off! don't know if he was pulling my leg or not 'cause I never saw any teams do it, but that's what he told me.

I have actually heard something like that before. I was watching an old Daytona 500 a few days ago, '86 or '87 and conversation somehow came to David Hobbs making some sort of mention of how he heard of Talcum powder being used for odd reasons in the past. I believe that's where I heard it.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by BringBackWilkesboro

I have actually heard something like that before. I was watching an old Daytona 500 a few days ago, '86 or '87 and conversation somehow came to David Hobbs making some sort of mention of how he heard of Talcum powder being used for odd reasons in the past. I believe that's where I heard it.

thanks BBW .. you restored my slipping credibility..

(the check's in the mail...)

[Bette]

Originally Posted by BringBackWilkesboro

I have actually heard something like that before. I was watching an old Daytona 500 a few days ago, '86 or '87 and conversation somehow came to David Hobbs making some sort of mention of how he heard of Talcum powder being used for odd reasons in the past. I believe that's where I heard it.

So your brother wasnt pulling your leg.
Its these sorts of things that make life interesting.
I still think its funny.

[lilsexy08]

Originally Posted by Quality88

huh ...... "Now That's a spicy meatball"

Totally racking my brain! I would say and only a guess, the person that would possibly win is the one driver is first to go a lap down! Man that made my brain hurt!

What is the step before Busch Series? and Has anyone ever heard of a Roy Dietsch in racing anywhere?

[PenelopePitStop]

Ok, experts! Here are my questions:

1. During Sunday's race, the announcers kept referring to the fact that Tony was driving the "same" car he won with two weeks ago.

Define "same". Is it the "same" body, suspension, etc.? It can't be the "same" engine, can it?

I always thought that an engine had a life span, and is never run beyond 500 miles for those in the big leagues who can afford to replace engines every week. Actually, once you reach Cup status, I would expect that every race brings a brand new engine.

Back when I was closely involved with the rinky-dink modifieds, most teams would replace parts when they could afford it, but didn't replace engines until they absolutely had to.

2. As Little E experienced this weekend, engines blow up! Why is that? These are supposed to be the best-engineered engines in NASCAR. Barring being damaged by debris, why on earth would any engine fail?

That's it! I'm ready to be dazzled by your brilliance!







http://www.smileycentral.com/sig.jsp?pc=ZSzeb096&pp=ZN

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

What is the step before Busch Series? and Has anyone ever heard of a Roy Dietsch in racing anywhere?

most feel the CTS is the step before Busch.

but there's another contingent that look to ARCA (a non NASCAR series) as the logical steppping stone. many times a racer who's having trouble in Busch will "step back" in to ARCA to get experience before moving "back up" to Busch.

sorry, never heard of Roy Dietsch.

[Lefty Noob]

Driver: Roy Dietsch

DOB: 04/16/1985

Clubs: WAI(Wisconsin Autocrossers Inc.) SCCA Milwaukee Region, Fox Valley Region

Experience: SCCA National Road Racing License. 5 years, Ice Racing, Rallycross, Autcross and Wheel to Wheel

Events: Mazda Rev It Up 2004 ZoomZoomLive2006 3rd Chicago

Awards:Solo Nationals 2005 4th place STS2(Top time North Course). SCCA MKE Region season Top 15 Drivers. WAI STS2 Season Champ 2004, SCCA MKE Region STS2 Champ 2004, 1:26.412 at Black Hawk, 2:56.761 at Road America

Vehicles: 1993 Miata STS2, #96 1991 Miata Spec Miata/ITA, 1994 Excel(Ice Racer)

SOURCE: BEATRacing.com - Driver Profiles

[simple simon]

do they still have Busch North ? i know a lot of drivers got their start there

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

Ok, experts! Here are my questions:

1. During Sunday's race, the announcers kept referring to the fact that Tony was driving the "same" car he won with two weeks ago.

Define "same". Is it the "same" body, suspension, etc.? It can't be the "same" engine, can it?

I always thought that an engine had a life span, and is never run beyond 500 miles for those in the big leagues who can afford to replace engines every week. Actually, once you reach Cup status, I would expect that every race brings a brand new engine.

Back when I was closely involved with the rinky-dink modifieds, most teams would replace parts when they could afford it, but didn't replace engines until they absolutely had to.

2. As Little E experienced this weekend, engines blow up! Why is that? These are supposed to be the best-engineered engines in NASCAR. Barring being damaged by debris, why on earth would any engine fail?

That's it! I'm ready to be dazzled by your brilliance!







http://www.smileycentral.com/sig.jsp?pc=ZSzeb096&pp=ZN

[brilliance on]
when they talk about it being the "same" car or truck it means the same chassis. each chassis is 'labeled' when it's built (the label etched into the frame), often with a number like 12 or 57, but sometimes they name them after people, pets, or mythical characters ("Bertha", "Spidey",) etc.. a top race team will have upwards of 20 chassis, each built for a specific purpose (type of track). some chassis may be very old (like 3 or 4 years!), others are fresh out of the box. bodies, engines, suspension, etc. are all "replaceable parts" so they aren't considered as being part of the "same" car.

like engines, there are teams that build their own and others that buy pre-built from one of the many chassis builders. although two chassis may be "identical", they will have different traits caused by slight differences in the material, the difference caused by the sum of manufacturing tolerances of the pieces, even atmospheric conditions when they were welded together! these differences cause slightly different handling and that's why drivers will have a "favorite" .. it "feels" right to them.

engines are "replaced" after every race. whether the engine is leased or owned, it goes back to the engine shop and is torn down, parts & clearances checked, reassembled, dynoed and put back "on the shelf" for the next time. just like chassis, each engine is specifically "designed" for a specific type of track, i.e., horsepower, torque, max rpm, restrictor plate, etc.

if the engine builders could build a "bullet proof" engine, they'd have every team beating a path to their door. but it's impossible, however the current engines are light years beyond what was available just 10 years ago. still there are failures, some caused by parts breaking, others by lubrication failure, some by "excessive" tuning (running the carburetor too lean or rich, adjusting the timing too far, etc.), all caused by the tremendous stress these engines are put under and the need to get as much power as possible.

I still haven't found out exactly what failed in Jr.'s engine. Jr. said a pulley (for one of the various belts) on the front of the engine broke. there was also the audio from the race where he said he'd lost power steering just before the engine "blew up". based on that, my best guess is that when the pulley failed, the power steering belt came off and took out the oil pump belt, which caused loss of oil pressure which caused a lubrication failure (remember the Tech Center touch screen illustration of the crankshaft and piston rod getting hot and a bolt breaking from the heat? that's what I believe was the actual engine failure .. the pulley was just the start of a chain of events.)

debris caused engine failures are rare, but do happen. some examples of a debris failure would be an oil line ruptured (these are steel braided lines - very hard to cut or tear), a radiator, cooler or oil pan penetration (causing a loss of coolant or lubricant), or the rarest: a belt cut by debris off the track. if you've ever seen film footage of the aftermath of a storm where wood splinters are driven into trees, telephone poles and houses, then imagine what a bolt or body piece can do to a race car traveling at 200 mph.

now is probably a good time to explain something about race engines of this type. unlike your car or truck engine, these engines don't store the oil in the engine .. for two reasons, heat and horsepower. there's actually a tank in the rear of the car (usually behind the driver but accessible only from the left rear wheel opening) that stores up to 5 gallons of oil. steel braided oil lines run from the tank forward to the engine delivering oil to and returning oil from the engine. your car or truck has the oil pump in the bottom of the engine and it draws oil from the "oil pan" at the bottom of the engine. these engines have a very sophisticated oil pump mounted externally, usually on the left front, of the engine that's driven by a cog belt coming directly off the crankshaft. this pump has 3 functions: draw oil from the tank and deliver it to the engine; pressurize the oil; and evacuate the used oil from the engine and return it to the tank. along the way to and from the oil pump the oil passes thru coolers and filters. also, the oil pan on these engines have been reduced in size (they don't store oil anymore) and are fitted with multiple scavenge points to "funnel" the used oil into scavenge lines (steel braided oil lines) going back to the pump. these lines (typically there are 3 or 4 of them) are the ones that usually "come loose" or are damaged as they are at the lowest point in the car and therefore exposed to debris off the track.
[brilliance off]

now you have enough information to be dangerous! go forth and impress your peers!

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by simple simon

do they still have Busch North ? i know a lot of drivers got their start there

now they are called "Busch" and "Busch West". "North" has been absorbed into the thing we call "Busch". for some reason, Busch West doesn't get the press or focus that "Busch" does. I know the cars are slightly different, but don't know what the differences are.

[lilsexy08]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

What is the step before Busch Series? and Has anyone ever heard of a Roy Dietsch in racing anywhere?

I could be wrong but is it ARCA? Roy um' I have heard of the name but I would need to do some research.

[BringBackWilkesboro]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

What is the step before Busch Series? and Has anyone ever heard of a Roy Dietsch in racing anywhere?

The step before Busch could be anywhere from the truck series to ARCA all the way down to USAC, and a couple of guys have come up from the Hooters Pro Cup, but most of those quickly fall off the radar.

The Hooters Pro Cup by the way is some great regional short track racing.

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

now you have enough information to be dangerous! go forth and impress your peers!

Holy crap! See why I call you my own personal NASCAR encyclopedia?

Chasis. I get it.

Actually, I started to question "parts" when Jr. lost his power steering couple of weeks ago. How the heck does that happen? It's not something you hear often. Then, toward the end of the race, the announcers mentioned that debris hit the "something" that caused his power steering to fail. How freakish is that?

[Quality88]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

Holy crap! See why I call you my own personal NASCAR encyclopedia?

Chasis. I get it.

Acutally, I started to question "parts" when Jr. lost his power steering couple of weeks ago. How the heck does that happen? It's not something you hear often. Then, toward the end of the race, the announcers mentioned that debris hit the "something" that caused his power steering to fail. How freakish is that?

I know certain belts have guards on them, however, it has been known to happen in which debris goes under the guard and causes the belt to jump. In the case of Jr, it sounded like the powersteering belt came off first, and when it came off it took off the belt that controls the oil pump. Result was no oil pumping in a high RPM engine, thus detonation.