[Phils20]

Originally Posted by Quality88

Seems like I remember somethin like that.... I'm not totally sure though Tuck



There that wasn't so hard now was it

Nope! IT was actually FUN!

[bob101]

I don't see how people think the COT has been great racing this year.

Look at Vegas and CA. If you started 30th you ran 30th all day and finished 30th. Same thing at Fontana. Tires were such a premium you didn't even have lead changes on pit stops when one team went 2 or 4 tires because all teams went 4 tires.

Today's race was just as bad if not worse. If not for 2 early debris cautions it was looking like the top 3 might lap the entire field. As it was 13 finished on the lead lap (and this wasn't a short track) and many of those because of the lucky dog. I bet we didn't see 20 passes on TV all day. It just wasn't there.

Don't know if it's the tire or the car, but announcers need to quit shoveling the you know what about how great these races this year have been.

All but Daytona have been track posistion races where if you got out front you stayed out front, qualifying posistion having a huge impact on these races.....

I do think Tony will get the "talk" at a minimum. You can gripe all you want until you bash a sponsor of the series in public - then all bets are off. He probably went overboard not griping about the tire but then talking trash about how Goodyear isn't in IRL, F1, etc.. anymore.

Let's not forget either that Goodyear just doesn't go to a test and pick a compound. They do what NASCAR tells them to do. If NASCAR wants a hard tire that they don't have to worry about tire failures (which to be honest is probably one of NASCAR's biggest fears/nightmares they show up to race a weekend and the tire won't make 20 laps without blowing...what to do they do? Call the race?) they spec a harder compound tire...

[NASCAR Gnome]

Originally Posted by Phils20

It seems a lot of folks seem to think a "tire war" would be bad for the sport. I'm not so sure.

Agreed - In fact, Sunoco is very lucky that "water in the gas" (RE: Denny Hamlin) issue last season was short-lived...

It was a popular thought that the Hooisers were responsible for Neil Bonnet and Rodney Orr losing thier lives in Daytona back in 1993. But there were quite a few teams trying out those tires. I am pretty sure that Alan Kulwicki was one of those teams.

Unfortunately for those great pioneers of this sport, the SAFETY equipment wasn't there for them as they are here today! Can you imagine Jeff Gordon's crash last week at Las Vegas in cars THOSE guys drove?!? Gordon would probably be one of the "remembered" in Church on Sundays!

[bob101]

Two things.

1. Stewart went WAY over the top. After the end of the race interview in the pits he gave another interview. He stated maybe Goodyear should go back to only making street tires, then maybe that wasn't such a great idea either. Said I'm going home and dismounting every Goodyear tire I own.

Ok that's over the top to make your point.

2. NASCAR isn't going to allow a tire war. Period. End of story. They did it before.

Right now it doesn't fit in AT ALL to what NASCAR is moving to. Face it, NASCAR is a 1/2 step away from competing in a spec car. They have a spec tire. No way do they want to open the door now for another tire. Period.

[oncea3fan]

I think they (nascar) should give the teams thier pick of tire compounds.
like alot of dirt tracks do , yeah you gotta run goodyears but the tire softness/hardness is up to you.
this would throw so stradgy back into the races.
team a betting on real soft tires, fast for 20 laps then prey for a yellow
team b is going with a harder tire not has fast but will last longer for the long green runs.

you could have the teams order set amount of tires before the race.
they get those and goodyear would bebring X amount of various compound tires, you must return a used set of tires to get a diffenrent compound, when thier gone thier gone.
no swapping between teams, cutts out multi car advantages.

[Phils20]

Originally Posted by oncea3fan

I think they (nascar) should give the teams thier pick of tire compounds.
like alot of dirt tracks do , yeah you gotta run goodyears but the tire softness/hardness is up to you.
this would throw so stradgy back into the races.
team a betting on real soft tires, fast for 20 laps then prey for a yellow
team b is going with a harder tire not has fast but will last longer for the long green runs.

you could have the teams order set amount of tires before the race.
they get those and goodyear would bebring X amount of various compound tires, you must return a used set of tires to get a diffenrent compound, when thier gone thier gone.
no swapping between teams, cutts out multi car advantages.

Intersting idea.

That could work!

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by bob101

Stewart went WAY over the top. After the end of the race interview in the pits he gave another interview. He stated maybe Goodyear should go back to only making street tires, then maybe that wasn't such a great idea either. Said I'm going home and dismounting every Goodyear tire I own.

I make no secret that I do not like Tony's attitude and a portion of what he said didn't make a whole lot of sense. His starting and ending positions tell a story that is far different than what he is making the tire issue sound like. I wonder if all the noise being made on forums today is because of what we "think" NASCAR might do to Tony or is it because we dislike his arrogant attitude and his overboard comments. Tony does shoot right from the hip and more often than not his emotions are speaking louder and faster than his brain can work.

Did he cross over the line in his comments ???? I would agree that he may have gone to far but he did what many other drivers do and that is to complain about the tire.Yes he put it into words that you and I might use as we are downing a beer and making our complaints about our boss. Again I dislike his attitude completely but if there is some factual evidence to what he said then maybe someone should take note of it. How many times have we all gone off about something only to express a point of view that is held by many. Remember now when Tony complained about the phantom debris issues and how things magically got better after that. Could it happen again ???

[Phils20]

Let's hope it does happen again. Like I said earlier, Jr and Gordon also complained about the tires, just in a more PC way.

We shall see.

But saying you are going to go home and dismount any Goodyears you have on your POV's is just funny! Over the top, but funny just the same!

Again, if someone else had said it, or if he had said it with a smile on his face, it wouldn't be as big a deal!

I still think it will be the fans loss when he leaves early.

I'm really getting to appreciate Tony, Kevin Harvick, and Kyle Busch. Even if they are dead wrong at times, at least they don't break out the "NASCAR speak" when they are asked a question!

Love em or hate em, isn't that what we wanted?

Or does "personality" only apply when a fan agrees with what they say?

At times "personality" is ugly, but at least it's real!

[LSC9901]

My point exactly Phil. We wanted to see real live human emotions and when we get them, although it seems he did go just a bit over the edge, "WE" complain. I really can't even believe that I am somewhat defending him. I still don't care for him and I'll agree that he may have gone a bit over the edge but then again ... who hasn't at one time or another.

[WestCoast]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

My point exactly Phil. We wanted to see real live human emotions and when we get them, although it seems he did go just a bit over the edge, "WE" complain. I really can't even believe that I am somewhat defending him. I still don't care for him and I'll agree that he may have gone a bit over the edge but then again ... who hasn't at one time or another.

Good answer...I'm sure your point of view is shared by many racers and fans.

[wardfan]

Maybe, just maybe ol' Tony was setting up a plan to get back into Indy racing. Don't they use Firestone's at the Indy 500?

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by wardfan

Maybe, just maybe ol' Tony was setting up a plan to get back into Indy racing. Don't they use Firestone's at the Indy 500?

My heart will not be broken should he choose to leave NASCAR.

[loco4pablo]

I don't know what's the reasoning for him going off like that. I mean it's not like he had a blow out and smacked the wall at 180. So goodyear missed the tire set up this weekend and the drivers and crews had to work a little harder.... Big deal!
Tony has been in NASCAR for 10 years and since then he has won 2 championships and a lot of races and a ton of money. All of this was done on Goodyear tires. Best of all he's never been seriously hurt due to a crash caused by tire failure. He should have just said "Goodyear dropped the ball this weekend" and left it at that. He probably has some inside interest with Hoosier or Firestone with his other ventures.
If he so miserable why doesn't he just go back and play in his little sandboxes where he can race how he wants.

[Racer Duck]

been reading several articles about what Tony, Jr., Gordo, Ryan and others have said about the tires at Atlanta. there's some facts that seem to pop out of all the emotion and rhetoric:

1. the tire was not the tire last tested at Atlanta - teams come to the race expecting the last tested tire and make initial setups according to the data from that test (yes, only a few teams get to participate, but if you think that info doesn't spread faster than a fire in a paint factory, you're wrong!)
2. the tire showed little or no wear after a normal number of laps - ok, it wore well. in fact it hardly wore at all. what teams expect is a tire to wear 50%-75% in a normal green flag run. this one didn't even reach that zone.
3. no tire failures due to excessive wear - this is a problem they've been fighting since the CON first came on the scene. but some drivers (Jr. said it out loud) prefer to take a chance on wearing out a tire in exchange for more grip.
4. the tire had much less grip than expected - was this the fault of the hard compound or something else? don't know. but, except for a few teams, everyone was having grip problems (and I think those teams that say they weren't are weren't being totaly truthful.)
5. sometimes it takes a fire bell to get people's attention! - Tony is happy to be the bell ringer.

I like the suggestion that teams be able to pick their compound. that puts the results squarely in the team's lap. On the other hand, it causes mega problems for the tire manufacturer .. it means they have to provide a "menu" of compounds available and stock/build enough to satisfy the projected need. it also requires a person (or group) of persons to manage the dispersement of tires to the teams so they get the compound they ordered. that means more work for them without an increase in price of the tire .. more work + same income = less profit.

it also is akin to telling Goodyear, we'll pick out the tires we think are best for us, your job is to make them. in other words, "we're the tire professionals, not you!"


BTW: for the uninitiated, tire wars fell by the wayside because racers first, then track owners and others discovered that each brand of tire has different chemical properties that "make them stick." they also found that mixing different chemical properties oftentimes decrease the "sticky-ness". in other words, if one race is run with one brand and the next race is on a different brand, the 2nd race suffers from low traction until "new rubber" can be built up - in some cases, it's actually worse than starting on a "green" track. the end result is the "spec" or "track" tire (and the resultant kick-back to the track/series). tracks that have different series competing on different "spec" tires still have the same problem...my local track is one such track - besides the "street tire" series, we have 3 different series on 3 different brands (Hoosier, American Racer [the old McCreary brand] and Goodyear), but the track owner is reluctant to mandate a track tire, thus each series must wrestle with the "changing conditions" of traction.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by bob101

Right now it doesn't fit in AT ALL to what NASCAR is moving to. Face it, NASCAR is a 1/2 step away from competing in a spec car. They have a spec tire. No way do they want to open the door now for another tire. Period.

Yep. You hit that one right out of the park!

"Spec Car," (which I think they have now; not a half step away) with a spec tire, which they also have; everyone runs the same tire each week, don't they?

All that is left is to run out all the small teams so franchising can be accomplished much easier.