[wingkey1]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

You might not have followed NASCAR long enough to remember, but every quality you mention above spells T-I-M R-I-C-H-M-O-N-D

mmmmmmm --- 50+ count?

While above is accurate, actually I'm one of them - time got little to do with it. What one does with the time -- EVERYTHING to do with it.

We'll be off to our local track tonite to watch some racin'. Wanna wager good number here won't. Tonight. Maybe ever.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by wingkey1

mmmmmmm --- 50+ count?

That puts you and I in about the same era.

Give Juablo a lot more hair and a mustache, take away the wife, family and mansion and replace them with a bevy of hookers and a houseboat on Biscayne Bay and you have Tim, driving style, refusal to be intimidated, and all.

[NASCAR Gnome]

As an aside...

I find it odd that many people call a race track like Sonoma or Laguna Seca a "road" course when in fact these are "circuit" tracks. To me, a true road course is Monaco or, more recently, even the streets of San Jose. Early in my life, I really enjoyed rally racing above all other forms - and for those of you who might not know what a rally race is, think of it as a dirt track race but not on an oval!

Speaking of rally cars, Subaru isn't well known by accident! They have been rally racing for years, as has Audi and Toyota and these companies have developed many technologies that have translated into the vehicles we drive on the streets! Auto racing, when done with intent, can be the greatest of technology platforms and we as consumers greatly benefit from these technologies.

Lastly, "road" races are tougher to watch because they can go around a track that stretches for miles and unless you have a TV nearby, it's really tough to follow all the action. In recent years - probably the last 20-25 years -I have grown extremely fond of oval track racing because it allows the fan who's at the race to follow the race all throughout. I've always thought that oval track racing was a truly American innovation but I think I'm wrong. The Romans had chariot races in their "ovals" many, many years ago and I'm just glad we Americans have taken that form and kept the "tradition" going! (Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't those ovals called "hippodromes"?)

[wingkey1]

Originally Posted by NASCAR Gnome

As an aside...

I find it odd that many people call a race track like Sonoma or Laguna Seca a "road" course when in fact these are "circuit" tracks. To me, a true road course is Monaco or, more recently, even the streets of San Jose. Early in my life, I really enjoyed rally racing above all other forms - and for those of you who might not know what a rally race is, think of it as a dirt track race but not on an oval!

Speaking of rally cars, Subaru isn't well known by accident! They have been rally racing for years, as has Audi and Toyota and these companies have developed many technologies that have translated into the vehicles we drive on the streets! Auto racing, when done with intent, can be the greatest of technology platforms and we as consumers greatly benefit from these technologies.

Lastly, "road" races are tougher to watch because they can go around a track that stretches for miles and unless you have a TV nearby, it's really tough to follow all the action. In recent years - probably the last 20-25 years -I have grown extremely fond of oval track racing because it allows the fan who's at the race to follow the race all throughout. I've always thought that oval track racing was a truly American innovation but I think I'm wrong. The Romans had chariot races in their "ovals" many, many years ago and I'm just glad we Americans have taken that form and kept the "tradition" going! (Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't those ovals called "hippodromes"?)

Interesting and even informative, yet - Holy Crap! Our roots are rum runners. Gotta remember, we didn't get paid greenbacks, it was "all you can drink". It was circles caus it was the best we could do under the circumstances. Chasin' the belief that were we once to reach the right speed, we could see out own taillights. It was our best interpretation of Einsteins theory of relativity. It was either that or marry yer cousin. We'd get lost right off in that all of the races in a season, whether oval, square, wiggley, egg-shapped, - make up the "circuit". Someone asked - "what come firts, chicken or egg" - we'd commit to go drink about it. Soon as a media type spoke of - "next week we'll be visiting the circuit course on the circuit" - there'd be mass efforts at self extermination. Death by Jack, blubber mass suffocation, moving indoors, giving up pork rinds.

Then there are rally races that never see dirt. Not an oval, no dirt - shoot the dog and disable the still it's gotta be a revenoor trick. Have participated in rally(e)s where no dirt was involved. Probably a Yuppie invention. They don't cotton ta dirt.

re: Road (or is it circuit? - OMG I'm spiraling already) are indeed tough in person. Frankly if you're not going for the/to party and/or meet and greet drivers and teams (they're quite accessible on the open wheel circuit - Oh Lord - I said circuit), ya may not like it. Recall we would put a clock on a driver we were following. If he/she did not show up in the "average" lap time, we could suspect problems on the course or with the tracked driver, or with the amount of partying the night before. Definitely with ya on this one.

Subaru's - tough little monkeys. Real tough. Should NASCAR ever include an enduro - look friggin' out.

Roman chariots - I liked the spoke strippers. Gotta be something similar that NASCAR can introduce. Perhaps only for the Chase. Right side rear only, and only allow on non-Chase cars. A "spoke ripped" car goes to the pits and the crowd gets the "thumbs" decision.

And if we've failed at arriving at total confusion - in Jersey (NJ) we call 'em circles, while in Massachusetts they call 'em rotarys. Hippodromes - ya gotta be in a zoo or Africa if yer seeing them.

Lastly - pure fun above. Please, take absolutely NO offense. None. As a precaution I will apologize in advance. Slow news day here. We're out back on the deck with binoculars lookin' for the State (NJ) bird. Oh, sorry - the mosquito.

Ain't gonna go edit the above. Even though we are quite sure it's a gramatical mess.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by NASCAR Gnome

As an aside...

I find it odd that many people call a race track like Sonoma or Laguna Seca a "road" course when in fact these are "circuit" tracks. To me, a true road course is Monaco or, more recently, even the streets of San Jose. Early in my life, I really enjoyed rally racing above all other forms - and for those of you who might not know what a rally race is, think of it as a dirt track race but not on an oval!

Speaking of rally cars, Subaru isn't well known by accident! They have been rally racing for years, as has Audi and Toyota and these companies have developed many technologies that have translated into the vehicles we drive on the streets! Auto racing, when done with intent, can be the greatest of technology platforms and we as consumers greatly benefit from these technologies.

Lastly, "road" races are tougher to watch because they can go around a track that stretches for miles and unless you have a TV nearby, it's really tough to follow all the action. In recent years - probably the last 20-25 years -I have grown extremely fond of oval track racing because it allows the fan who's at the race to follow the race all throughout. I've always thought that oval track racing was a truly American innovation but I think I'm wrong. The Romans had chariot races in their "ovals" many, many years ago and I'm just glad we Americans have taken that form and kept the "tradition" going! (Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't those ovals called "hippodromes"?)

I used to watch the rallys on EuroSports when I lived in Europe. Rallys are good examples of a race that is best seen on TV. In person I found rallys to be kind of watching the Tour d' France, except with engine noise.

Professional road racing is this country is pretty much a thing of the past due to insurance concerns. Now they have Long beach and I can't immediately think of any others. My personal opinion is that full-bodied stock cars, as NASCAR and ARCA runs, are not suited to road racing. If you like road racing with a ton of action, the European Grand Touring Series is, IMNSVHO, about as good as it gets. Austrailian Supercar Series is awfully good too, as our friend here, Clutch, will attest too.

Correct on the hippodrome. They held horse and chariot races in the hippodrome portion of the circus stadium. Interesting analogy of auto racing to the Roman games. Let it be said that when, during driver introductions, when the first driver raises his hand to Mike HIlton and says, "We, who are about to die, salute you," I switch off the set and have watched my last NASCAR race. <VBG>

[tkj24]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

That puts you and I in about the same era.

Give Juablo a lot more hair and a mustache, take away the wife, family and mansion and replace them with a bevy of hookers and a houseboat on Biscayne Bay and you have Tim, driving style, refusal to be intimidated, and all.

Yes and look what the bevy of hookers got him...
What a waste.

[jks812]

I've gotten to where I like Montoya. At first I didn't. And it's not that I didn't like him. I didn't like how he came straight to the cup series, no running busch and getting experience with these cars or anything. Now I've noticed he picked this stuff up pretty quick. Goes to a track he's never been on before and does pretty decent, does better than some that ran busch and all for awhile before coming to cup. Now that he's got his first cup win out of the way, I want him to win on an oval. And one thing that I do love about him is his attitude.

[JG24]

At first i didnt think much of montoya, especially after he wrecked his teamate for the win in mexico. Last weeks race was a step in the right direction for him though.

[Racer Duck]

seems to be a few "at first I didn't .. but now..." converts...

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

seems to be a few "at first I didn't .. but now..." converts...

Kind of shows that many of us appreciate a driver who races to win, not just get points, doesn't it?

Like him or dislike him, there is one thing I don't believe anyone can say about Juablo; he makes the race a bit more interesting.

[jks812]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

seems to be a few "at first I didn't .. but now..." converts...

I don't instantly like no new driver.

[JG24]

Originally Posted by jks812

I don't instantly like no new driver.

Yep thts how i feel. if u come into the sport you have to earn my respect on and off the race track

[simple simon]

Originally Posted by jks812

I don't instantly like no new driver.

Originally Posted by JG24

Yep thts how i feel. if u come into the sport you have to earn my respect on and off the race track

sounds like text book band wagon jumpers

[Nevadastars]

Originally Posted by simple simon

sounds like text book band wagon jumpers

Simon, you crack me up!

[jks812]

Nope not even close. Not a band wagon kind of person but I also can't say I like a new driver that I don't know.Besides I said I like him and hope he does good and hopes he wins. Didn't say I was a fan.