[PenelopePitStop]

Ok. I'm done playing "Breaking-News-Anchor-Woman" on this topic, but I thought this was interesting ... I'll leave other new related Threads to the rest of you!

NASCAR.COM - Penalties may be same, but effects differ from others - Jun 26, 2007

[simple simon]

well i skimmed that over and it seems the author thinks JG and JJ should have been punished more because they are better then everyone else ?

[jks812]

I thought he was saying that though their penalties are the same, it's not as bad on Gordon. Gordon will still stay the leader and Jimmie will drop a spot. Then he's talking about penalties that have dropped other drivers in positions.

[Quality88]

Originally Posted by simple simon

well i skimmed that over and it seems the author thinks JG and JJ should have been punished more because they are better then everyone else ?

huh? I couldn't follow that.... or well.... I guess you could make the case because they are at the top of the heap right now.... why should they pull a stunt like this when they are dominating. Not sayin they should just makin a point.

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by simple simon

well i skimmed that over and it seems the author thinks JG and JJ should have been punished more because they are better then everyone else ?

Don't know. I certainly don't feel that way. I think the author was just pointing out the difference between HMS and other less successful teams being fined the same. It's like fining a millionaire and the average Joe for a speeding violation. Doesn't mean squat to the millionaire, but the average Joe may not be able to buy groceries for a week!

Again, no. I don't think HMS should have been fined more because they are better. Not at all. In fact, if that was the case, I would have been just as annoyed with NASCAR as the average HMS fan would.

[jks812]

1.Gordon's 100-point penalty doesn't even knock him out of first place

2.Johnson drops from third to fifth in the standings.

Thats what I got from it,that although they have the same penalties, Jeff loses no spots in points while Jimmie loses 2 spots in points. And then he's talking about where some others would be if not for penalties.
I think he's just trying to say penalties are the same but the results aren't.

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by jks812

1.Gordon's 100-point penalty doesn't even knock him out of first place

2.Johnson drops from third to fifth in the standings.

Thats what I got from it,that although they have the same penalties, Jeff loses no spots in points while Jimmie loses 2 spots in points. And then he's talking about where some others would be if not for penalties.
I think he's just trying to say penalties are the same but the results aren't.

Exactly. And as far as I'm concerned, he's right! At this point, I am just throwing my hands in the air. What a shame.

Perhaps, and this is just an idea, instead of docking points, NASCAR should dock positions in points. You cheat, you go back one or two positions no matter what the points total would be. And yes, this even goes for my favorite drivers. Alas, I'm not a member of NASCAR, so what do I know?

I don't think NASCAR should bring HMS to its knees, but I'm sure HMS is laughing all the way to the bank. Has this tarnished their reputation? I doubt it. Fans are fans.

On the other hand, Jeffey and Johnson had a bank of points to mess with. At the end of the season, none of this will matter.

[simple simon]

Originally Posted by PenelopePitStop

Perhaps, and this is just an idea, instead of docking points, NASCAR should dock positions in points. You cheat, you go back one or two positions no matter what the points total would be. And yes, this even goes for my favorite drivers. Alas, I'm not a member of NASCAR, so what do I know?

i cant see that working at all

let's look at it this way

JG and JPM both go to Loudon inspection and get caught cheating for the exact same thing .... JG is 171 points in front of Hamlin and JPM is tied for 20th in points ......... under your plan JG loses 172 points to drop position in the standings behind Hamlin and JPM loses 1 point to drop to 21st position in points ........... they both lose only one position in points, but it hardly seems fair

hope that sounds as clear on the forum as it does in my head

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by simple simon

i cant see that working at all

let's look at it this way

JG and JPM both go to Loudon inspection and get caught cheating for the exact same thing .... JG is 171 points in front of Hamlin and JPM is tied for 20th in points ......... under your plan JG loses 172 points to drop position in the standings behind Hamlin and JPM loses 1 point to drop to 21st position in points ........... they both lose only one position in points, but it hardly seems fair

hope that sounds as clear on the forum as it does in my head

huh????

[simple simon]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

huh????

which part did you not understand ?

[jks812]

Originally Posted by simple simon

i cant see that working at all

let's look at it this way

JG and JPM both go to Loudon inspection and get caught cheating for the exact same thing .... JG is 171 points in front of Hamlin and JPM is tied for 20th in points ......... under your plan JG loses 172 points to drop position in the standings behind Hamlin and JPM loses 1 point to drop to 21st position in points ........... they both lose only one position in points, but it hardly seems fair

hope that sounds as clear on the forum as it does in my head

That's basically what he's saying. They got the same penalty but it affected each one different. Moved Jimmie but not Jeff.

[Racer Duck]

Originally Posted by simple simon

which part did you not understand ?

you make a simple thing so complicated:

1. why would JG cheat when he just got hit with a stiff penalty?
2. how in the world would JG's crew chief and JPM's crew chief decide to cheat the exact same way?
3. why would JPM cheat? he just won his first race in NASCAR. the glow hasn't worn off yet.
4. so JG is minused (??) 172 points .. why not 200?
5. and JPM is minused (?? again) 1 point .. again, why not 200?
6. is the poiint of this mental exercise to tire me out and send me to bed or what?
7. what, in your experience, has been fair about NASCAR?

** it was a good example, though. don't like the concept, nonetheless You Did Good.

[simple simon]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

you make a simple thing so complicated:

1. why would JG cheat when he just got hit with a stiff penalty?
2. how in the world would JG's crew chief and JPM's crew chief decide to cheat the exact same way?
3. why would JPM cheat? he just won his first race in NASCAR. the glow hasn't worn off yet.
4. so JG is minused (??) 172 points .. why not 200?
5. and JPM is minused (?? again) 1 point .. again, why not 200?
6. is the poiint of this mental exercise to tire me out and send me to bed or what?
7. what, in your experience, has been fair about NASCAR?

** it was a good example, though. don't like the concept, nonetheless You Did Good.

i thought i made it simple ......... and in answer to most all of your questions, my example was to show PPS why her idea of losing position in the standings instead of points wouldnt work (that answers your points 4 and 5) the rest is just a simple hypothetical to tie it all together

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by simple simon

i cant see that working at all

let's look at it this way

JG and JPM both go to Loudon inspection and get caught cheating for the exact same thing .... JG is 171 points in front of Hamlin and JPM is tied for 20th in points ......... under your plan JG loses 172 points to drop position in the standings behind Hamlin and JPM loses 1 point to drop to 21st position in points ........... they both lose only one position in points, but it hardly seems fair

hope that sounds as clear on the forum as it does in my head

Clear? No. But it's very early in the morning, so my brain isn't so sharp right now.

I do, however, see what you're getting at. 1 point versus 172 doesn't seem fair. I agree. But JG versus JPM is comparing apples and oranges. Perhaps having more to lose would cause teams not to cheat ... I don't have any answers ... just lots of questions.

For the life of me, I still can't understand why HMS would pull such a stunt at this point in the season. I just don't get it. I'm not buying this "grey area" BS. Beyond that, I'm still not convinced that any driver would know that the CC was "cheating" and not take issue with it.

At the end of the day, NASCAR doesn't give a rat's a$$ what you, me, or the man in the moon think. Nature of the beast, I guess.

On another note, I don't follow Hamlin at all, but second in points? Pretty good. I'll have to pay closer attention. Sleeping gun?

[PenelopePitStop]

Originally Posted by simple simon

i thought i made it simple ......... and in answer to most all of your questions, my example was to show PPS why her idea of losing position in the standings instead of points wouldnt work (that answers your points 4 and 5) the rest is just a simple hypothetical to tie it all together

RD and Simple, you're killing me!

"6. is the poiint of this mental exercise to tire me out and send me to bed or what?", caused me to giggle myself into tears! I'm serious!

My idea was just that, an idea ... a thought. I'm not saying it's right or wrong.

As I've said, Jeffey had a bank of points to mess with. That's just the way it is ... I think he's on his way to another championship regardless of his team's cheating ...

Sad ... very sad ...






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