[Racer Duck]

an interesting perspective on one of our "favorites"...
NASCAR.COM - CART passing on Gordon the greatest error in racing - May 26, 2007

[Mike24]

I always ask myself the question. Would have Jeff Gordon won more championships in IRL? I can't believe IRL passed up a talent like Jeff. But for some reason the IRL at the time didn't see Americans talented enough for that type of racing. Gordon is talented at driving any type of car, and Rick Hendrick saw that, and signed him. Look at him now, he's won 4 championships and working on a 5th this year, and is one of the most popular drivers in NASCAR. IRL sure did make a mistake.

[jks812]

Yes they did make a very big boo boo.

[LSC9901]

I'd have to believe that Jeff is making more $$$$ through NASCAR than he would with IRL.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Racer Duck

an interesting perspective on one of our "favorites"...
NASCAR.COM - CART passing on Gordon the greatest error in racing - May 26, 2007

Great link, Duck. I seldom, if ever, read anything from NASCAR.com so I'd missed this one. Thank you.

I found the following (cut & pasted from the original) especially interesting:
"...early 1990s, team owners in Championship Auto Racing Teams -- CART, which has since morphed into Champ Car -- decided he didn't fit the mold.

No, they didn't want oval-track drivers, even open-wheeled ones like Gordon who dreamed of racing in the Indianapolis 500. This was before the 1996 split, before the advent of the Indy Racing League, when most open-wheel races in North America were on road and street courses. "

This is why I did handsprings when T.G. told Penske, Ganassi, and friends to shove it. I thought he had gotten the message that Americans wanted to see American drivers, driving front-engined American cars, running oval American races. Boy, did I blow THAT assumption! Now, with every passing season, IRL looks more and more like an over-tech'd rear-engined, bunch of F1 wannabes.

Not only did they lose Jeffy-Pooh, they also lost Tony, Robby Gordon, Ryan Newman, J.J. Yeley, Kasey Kahne, Casey Mears, Dave Blaney, Mike Bliss, Jason Leffler, and now apparently A.J. Almendinger. Major league open wheel in this country just keeps shooting themsleves ion their collective feet, don't they?

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Mike24

I always ask myself the question. Would have Jeff Gordon won more championships in IRL? I can't believe IRL passed up a talent like Jeff. But for some reason the IRL at the time didn't see Americans talented enough for that type of racing. Gordon is talented at driving any type of car, and Rick Hendrick saw that, and signed him. Look at him now, he's won 4 championships and working on a 5th this year, and is one of the most popular drivers in NASCAR. IRL sure did make a mistake.

Bill Davis and Ford saw his talent. Together they brought Jeff to NASCAR, but believed that Jeff was as good as his word. THEN Hendrick saw him and they found out Jeff's verbal promise to stay with them wasn't enough. Davis found out that he had lost his future Cup driver on Charlotte's 6:00 news.

That has been about the only objectionable thing I have ever found to criticize Jeff over, but, to me, lack of character is a very big thing.

[Team Yates]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

Bill Davis and Ford saw his talent. Together they brought Jeff to NASCAR, but believed that Jeff was as good as his word. THEN Hendrick saw him and they found out Jeff's verbal promise to stay with them wasn't enough. Davis found out that he had lost his future Cup driver on Charlotte's 6:00 news.

That has been about the only objectionable thing I have ever found to criticize Jeff over, but, to me, lack of character is a very big thing.

Here, here!!!! Can't get much clearer than that!!

[Mike24]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

Bill Davis and Ford saw his talent. Together they brought Jeff to NASCAR, but believed that Jeff was as good as his word. THEN Hendrick saw him and they found out Jeff's verbal promise to stay with them wasn't enough. Davis found out that he had lost his future Cup driver on Charlotte's 6:00 news.

That has been about the only objectionable thing I have ever found to criticize Jeff over, but, to me, lack of character is a very big thing.

All Gordon saw was a better owner, with better equipment and resources, and Hendrick signed him. And to his benefit, he's won 4 championships. I believe Gordon would be where he is at today with any team, he just saw a better fit with another team, and of course Hendrick saw that too.

[LSC9901]

I think the scenerio is one that many would follow. It is too bad that when you make a verbal agreement with someone that it isn't honored, but then again put some of the blame where it belongs. Why didn't BDR get something in writing ? I'm sure when HMS saw the possibilities, they made a contractual deal. A liitle more difficult to default on than the verbal agreement.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by Mike24

All Gordon saw was a better owner, with better equipment and resources, and Hendrick signed him. And to his benefit, he's won 4 championships. I believe Gordon would be where he is at today with any team, he just saw a better fit with another team, and of course Hendrick saw that too.

We went through this discussion about a year agao. It ended up being apparent that the concept of honor, ethical behaviour and character is age-dependent thing. I personally come from a generation where character and ethics are not situational, and are to be honored only if something better doesn't come along.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

We went through this discussion about a year agao. It ended up being apparent that the concept of honor, ethical behaviour and character is a generational thing. I personally come from a generation where character and ethics are not situational, and are to be honored only if something better doesn't come along.

I'm with you 100% Bob, it's like you said in your post, todays generation look at honor a wee bit differently.

[Bob Tanner]

Originally Posted by LSC9901

I think the scenerio is one that many would follow. It is too bad that when you make a verbal agreement with someone that it isn't honored, but then again put some of the blame where it belongs. Why didn't BDR get something in writing ? I'm sure when HMS saw the possibilities, they made a contractual deal. A little more difficult to default on than the verbal agreement.

[In a perfect world, or maybe better said, another time] Why is it necessary to have written contract? If a man's promise is worth nothing, then are you dealing with an honest man?

And if a man knows that a driver has an agreement with another driver but he convinces the driver to go back on his promised word, then what does that say about the person who "steals" the driver? Is that man an honest man?

Ooops! I just put "honesty" and Hendrick in the same thought. Sorry My faux pas. The man is a convicted felon on multiple counts, and that about says it all, IRT character.

[Mike24]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

[In a perfect world, or maybe better said, another time] Why is it necessary to have written contract? If a man's promise is worth nothing, then are you dealing with an honest man?

And if a man knows that a driver has an agreement with another driver but he convinces the driver to go back on his promised word, then what does that say about the person who "steals" the driver? Is that man an honest man?

Ooops! I just put "honesty" and Hendrick in the same thought. Sorry My faux pas. The man is a convicted felon on multiple counts, and that about says it all, IRT character.

Your saying Hendrick isn't honest because he got Gordon while the opportunity lasted? If Bill Davis wanted Gordon, he should have signed him to a contract. A verbal agreement doesn't mean he will stay with the team, but a written contract does. Hendrick saw a talent, and got him before Bill Davis did. Gordon wasn't dishonest, and Hendrick wasn't either.

Matter of fact, maybe Bill Davis made the greatest error in racing, not signing Jeff Gordon while the opportunity was there? But Bill Davis relied on a verbal agreement, and you don't do that. Sometimes you have to go to another team that you see a better fit with, and Gordon saw that, and Hendrick signed him.

Bottom line is, if I was in Gordon's position and I knew there wasn't a written contract saying I have to stay with the team, I would look at other options and see if there may be a better fit. Gordon saw that, and so did Hendrick. Bill Davis has nothing to blame but himself for letting Gordon go.

[Lefty Noob]

I agree completely with Bob on this one, but sadly, I've been covering sports too long to know that a gentleman's agreement is worth a hill of beans these days. Just look at how many high school football players go back on verbal committments to colleges these days. For that matter, a contract isn't worth much these days either -- look at all the stick and ball coaches leaving while under contract (one had even just signed a new deal with one school before jumping ship to a new school in the same week) and how players attempt to renegotiate contracts on a regular basis. With the "standardization" of NASCAR I'm guessing that it's only a matter of time before some of these problems creep in as well.

But I digress. The topic at hand is CART's failure to land Jeff Gordon, and without a doubt it was a costly, costly mistake for the racing league. Someone like Gordon or Junior is exactly what the IRL needs right now. Hard to give two figs about the Indy 500 when I'm really only familiar with three drivers in it -- Dan Wheldon, Marco Andretti and Danica Patrick.

[Mike24]

Originally Posted by Lefty Noob

I agree completely with Bob on this one, but sadly, I've been covering sports too long to know that a gentleman's agreement is worth a hill of beans these days. Just look at how many high school football players go back on verbal committments to colleges these days. For that matter, a contract isn't worth much these days either -- look at all the stick and ball coaches leaving while under contract (one had even just signed a new deal with one school before jumping ship to a new school in the same week) and how players attempt to renegotiate contracts on a regular basis. With the "standardization" of NASCAR I'm guessing that it's only a matter of time before some of these problems creep in as well.

But I digress. The topic at hand is CART's failure to land Jeff Gordon, and without a doubt it was a costly, costly mistake for the racing league. Someone like Gordon or Junior is exactly what the IRL needs right now. Hard to give two figs about the Indy 500 when I'm really only familiar with three drivers in it -- Dan Wheldon, Marco Andretti and Danica Patrick.

It's about where you fit the best, and where you feel like you can succeed at the best. At the time Jeff felt like he wasn't fitting in, and Hendrick got him before any other owners had a chance. That's why I hate verbal agreements. Most likely you won't keep it because there is always a chance that there is another organization that you feel like you can fit in. Gordon saw that, and so did Hendrick.

Anyways, IRL sure did make a mistake. They should try and keep their top stars instead of letting them go to NASCAR.