[LSC9901]

There is no question that the face of NASCAR is constantly changing. I'll continue to watch it because I enjoy the basic premise of it. That is racing. I'm not a major open wheel fan. I watch the Indy 500 because of the steeped tradition of it but I like the banging and bumping of the NASCAR type vehicles. Probably another draw for me, which is passing, is that many of the drivers easily relate to their fans. Again not as much today as 20 years ago but I have no way of relating to Fittapaldi or drivers like him. Even though the car itself is changing it is more in line with the auto I can relate to. I see cars that look similar to it but I never see an open wheel Lotus or whatever they drive on my street.

Obviously we all have our choices and I guess I'll remain with the "winged brick" for a while yet.

[Phils20]

I think the big thing with this car for me is the safety aspect of it. These teams will get a handle on the car, and get it to perform better. These teams are smarter than ever, and it will drive better.

Personally, with about 10 drivers dead, just in NASCAR over the last decade or so, I can deal with a car that makes things safer. I'm just a little tired of losing folks like Earnhardt, Petty, Irwin, Roper, Alexander, Bonnett, Orr, and many others I have forgotten about.

Most of the folks that say they will leave won't, I know a lot of times I tell myself some idiot call, or dropping of a track, is just the last straw, but I'm an addict. NASCAR gives you something most other racing just can't do, although I'm a big fan of the others for those differences.

Change will happen. And it has been happening since we let teams make cars as opposed to buying them and modifying them. It has been and will be, in a constant state of change since they left the beach, and always will be!

C you at the track!

If you are coming to Dover, let me know, I'll ice on down for ya!

[Quality88]

Originally Posted by Mike24

I will respond to this with one sentence.

If NASCAR doesn't change with the times, there will be no NASCAR.

Well mike... Nascar has changed with the times and it has caused there to be no NASCAR.... we now have NA$CAR. JMHO

[Mike24]

Originally Posted by Quality88

Well mike... Nascar has changed with the times and it has caused there to be no NASCAR.... we now have NA$CAR. JMHO

Every sport, organization, etc etc wants to earn money. If they don't get money, then that organization won't last very long. NASCAR has always been out to make money, but they had to build their sport first. Now that their sport has been built, they can focus on other areas, while they focus on the racing.

[LSC9901]

Nothing ever remains the same. Change will always ocurr in NASCAR and there will always be a small percentage that cannot adapt. There will always be those who join NASCAR nation because it is the thing to do. For those fans the door will always be revolving.

[clutch]

Originally Posted by Phils20

Other than the wing, which really isn't that bad, I think they look Better than the old cars. Watch the Sat race, with the cars all out of whack, then look on a COT race, and see how the cars are "square" on the chassis, and how the noses aren't all stretched out like a fun house mirror.

PLus, it will be cheaper for all the teams, since there will be no track specific cars, one you take out all the gray area. I think the Dale Jr fine is proof that they are not going to let these cars become the twisted mess that the old ones became.

Embrace the change, a new era of racing is coming soon. Let's hope it kkeps the drivers safer, and liven up the competition. Even though Hendrick seems to have this thing down, that gap will change. Look how DEI concentrated on the plate tracks, and dominated for a bit. But the other teams closed that gap. The longer they race these things, the better the other teams will become.

This was the right call.

Just thought I'd bring this back as Phils20 is pretty much dead on with his assessment.......the racing seems as good as ever .......certainly the best in recent years. after much complaining about the introduction of the COT most seem to like it now...........or are some still unconvinced???......

[wingkey1]

Originally Posted by clutch

Just thought I'd bring this back as Phils20 is pretty much dead on with his assessment.......the racing seems as good as ever .......certainly the best in recent years. after much complaining about the introduction of the COT most seem to like it now...........or are some still unconvinced???......

Phils got a lot of "on" in his perception.

Wondering what races are included in the - "the racing seems as good as ever .......certainly the best in recent years" - assessment. Expect yer including more than YTD, since YTD is only the 500? Unclear whether the short sprints (Duel & Shootout) are, or even should be, included.

Lotta credit was given by the "experts"(?) to the rear wing configuration (end piece verticals) as being cause for the drivers being able to recover from heretofore "un-recoverable" vehicle attitudes. Comments sounding at times to be - helping straighten the car out. Wonder how many buy in to this?

COT is not worse than the most recent prior thing. Fact is, based on driver comments that indicate it requires more driver than the previous thing, we feel it is better. Does it look like the showroom version? No, but that day is over unless there are significant changes to the venues - and that ain't happening - so it's over. Those who cannot deal with this (Sprint level), need to find other interests that do not negatively impact their blood pressure.

[clutch]

Originally Posted by wingkey1

Lotta credit was given by the "experts"(?) to the rear wing configuration (end piece verticals) as being cause for the drivers being able to recover from heretofore "un-recoverable" vehicle attitudes. Comments sounding at times to be - helping straighten the car out. Wonder how many buy in to this?

Wing, I think that I fall into that category. It certainly appears that way. We've seen many guys have the rear end slide around on them, but some seem able to recover and keep it down low before headin straight for the wall and/or other cars........Although I now expect you to tell my why I am wrong....which is fine LOL


and of course I wasnt just talking the first race of the season.....although driving characteristics of the car really impressed me......especially the 18's manouverability .....I meant all COT races thus far.
..JMHO

[wingkey1]

Originally Posted by clutch

Wing, I think that I fall into that category. It certainly appears that way. We've seen many guys have the rear end slide around on them, but some seem able to recover and keep it down low before headin straight for the wall and/or other cars........Although I now expect you to tell my why I am wrong....which is fine LOL

Although I now expect you to tell my why I am wrong - dang. Hate it when I fail to meet expectations. 'fraid I'm in the category as well.

Have had the unique opportunity to witness aero engineering efforts associated with wingtip vortices on "heavys" (Boeing 747, Douglas DC10's, etc.) at FAA facility Pomona in New Jersey. Memory test, but believe it was in the early 70's. They had one of our small computer systems in what amounted to a little shack between two smoke towers at the end of the runway. Was fascinating, in between the times of scared to death, to watch to what amounted to be two nasty and long horizontal tornados off the tip of each wing show themselves as the heavy passed low, slow, and dirty through the smoke towers. On still days the "tornados" would settle straight down to the ground. In days with a crosswind, they'd settle on our little shack - holy crap!

Crazy wild too was seeing that the instant the heavy touched down, the tornados immediately stopped. This is why, we later learned, that aircraft landing immediately behind another will make their touchdown just slightly longer than the one that just landed ahead of them. But we stray badly here. Sorry.

Interestingly, soon as the heavys were outfitted with winglets on their tips, no more wingtip tornados. No more tornados meant cleaner air for those following behind, and less drag caused by air "spilling" over the edge of the wing which increased directional stability for the driver(pilot).

Now while we've witnessed all this aircraft based evidence, can not honestly tell you we expected to see what indeed appeared to be increased control of the cars. However we're one of those overly cautious - lemme see and think about this a few more times before we go spoutin' off on it.

[clutch]

Originally Posted by wingkey1

Although I now expect you to tell my why I am wrong - dang. Hate it when I fail to meet expectations. 'fraid I'm in the category as well.

Have had the unique opportunity to witness aero engineering efforts associated with wingtip vortices on "heavys" (Boeing 747, Douglas DC10's, etc.) at FAA facility Pomona in New Jersey. Memory test, but believe it was in the early 70's. They had one of our small computer systems in what amounted to a little shack between two smoke towers at the end of the runway. Was fascinating, in between the times of scared to death, to watch to what amounted to be two nasty and long horizontal tornados off the tip of each wing show themselves as the heavy passed low, slow, and dirty through the smoke towers. On still days the "tornados" would settle straight down to the ground. In days with a crosswind, they'd settle on our little shack - holy crap!

Crazy wild too was seeing that the instant the heavy touched down, the tornados immediately stopped. This is why, we later learned, that aircraft landing immediately behind another will make their touchdown just slightly longer than the one that just landed ahead of them. But we stray badly here. Sorry.

Interestingly, soon as the heavys were outfitted with winglets on their tips, no more wingtip tornados. No more tornados meant cleaner air for those following behind, and less drag caused by air "spilling" over the edge of the wing which increased directional stability for the driver(pilot).

Now while we've witnessed all this aircraft based evidence, can not honestly tell you we expected to see what indeed appeared to be increased control of the cars. However we're one of those overly cautious - lemme see and think about this a few more times before we go spoutin' off on it.

Thats very interesting stuff Wing.......I notice even newer 737s and even the baby airbus have wingtips, however the aging 767s and even our brand new 777s dont have them?? (I work for our "Big" airline)

...but back to the cars, I guess that after this fist full year we should have a more conclusive answer