[Hassan]

The changes are finally announced and I can say that there isn't any surprise, what do you guys think of the changes to the points system and Chase format NASCAR has announced for 2007?

---

I think that the changes are good, now we can see drivers compete for winning races not top 5 or top 10 finishes but who knows...time will decide how good the changes are

[LSC9901]

Changes announced to points system and Chase

Ten points awarded per victory; two drivers added to playoff format

Official Release
January 22, 2007

DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. -- Race victories will become more important than ever in 2007 as a result of adjustments to the points system and the Chase for the Nextel Cup format announced Monday by NASCAR.
The adjustments are designed to establish more balance between winning and consistency, but there is a new emphasis on the former.

CHASE ADJUSTMENTS
• 400-point cutoff eliminated • Top-12 drivers qualify • Point totals adjusted to 5,000 • Drivers "seeded" by wins • 10-point bonus for each win
'06 RACE MAXIMUM -- 190
• Race win = 180 points • Lead a lap = 5 points • Most laps led = 5 points
'07 RACE MAXIMUM -- 195
• Race win = 185 points • Lead a lap = 5 points • Most laps led = 5 points
MESSAGE BOARD
What do you think of the changes to the points system and Chase format NASCAR has announced for 2007?


"The adjustments taken [Monday] put a greater emphasis on winning races," NASCAR chairman and CEO Brian France said. "Winning is what this sport is all about. Nobody likes to see drivers content to finish in the top 10. We want our sport -- especially during the Chase -- to be more about winning."
The Chase -- consisting of the season's last 10 races -- will further reflect the importance of racing to win, via a variety of adjustments.
During the format's first three years, the top-10 drivers in points after the 26th race of the season (at Richmond International Raceway) qualified for the Chase; in addition, any other driver outside the top 10 but within 400 points of the standings' leader was also eligible.
Starting this season, the 400-point cutoff is eliminated and the top-12 drivers in the points after Race 26 will qualify for the Chase.
All 12 drivers will have their point totals re-set to 5,000; each will then receive a 10-point bonus for each race victory they had during the first 26 races.
The Chase drivers will be "seeded" to start the Chase based on the number of wins amassed during the regular season.
"I like that the points for each of the now 12 drivers in the Chase will be set at 5,000 with an additional 10 for each race win," said team owner Richard Childress, who had two drivers in the 2006 Chase.
"We want our sport -- especially during the Chase -- to be more about winning. "
- Brian France


In line with the Chase adjustments, wins throughout the season will be more valuable.
Race winners throughout the 36-race season will now receive 185 points, a five-point increase.
"I'm happy to see NASCAR increase the points for winning a race," Childress said. "It makes winning that much more important. ... After all, winning is what this sport is all about."
Counting the five-point bonuses available for leading at least one lap and leading the most laps, a race winner now can earn a maximum of 195 points, creating a possible maximum of 25 points between first- and second-place finishers.
The 2006 season of Kasey Kahne provides a dramatic illustration of the adjusted Chase format's implications.
Kahne qualified for last year's Chase, but started it in 10th place -- despite having won a series-high five races. Under the new format, Kahne would begin the Chase in first place, with 5,050 points.
"These changes should make the Chase for the championship even more exciting for the race fans and more competitive for the teams," Childress noted.

[LSC9901]

New points would have affected some title races

By Mark Aumann, NASCAR.COM
January 22, 2007

If NASCAR's decision to award five more points to the winner of each race had been in effect since the invention of the current points system in 1975, the record book would look quite different.
Not only would Jimmie Johnson be celebrating his second championship in the past three seasons, but Richard Petty's seventh championship would have been achieved by just one point, and Jeff Gordon would have already won five. Jeff Gordon would be looking for the pick six, instead of the drive for five.
CHANGES ANNOUNCED

Wins will be more important than ever following changes to the points system and Chase.


An analysis of how the new rules changes would have affected each season's championship illustrate how expanding the Chase for the Nextel Cup field to 12 drivers -- with the exception of Tony Stewart's 2006 season -- would have had a negligible effect on the standings.
In fact, much of the drama at Richmond the past two seasons would have been diminished by the new format.
However, what appears at first glance to be a subtle change to the points system -- giving another five points to the winner of each race -- would have had major ramifications if applied retroactively.
Consider 1979, Richard Petty's seventh and final championship season. He edged Darrell Waltrip that year by 11 points. However, if you take into consideration that Waltrip won seven races to Petty's five, Petty would have won the title by a single point.
Alan Kulwicki's 1992 comeback would have ended up as a nice rally instead of a championship, since Bill Elliott won five races to Kulwicki's two that season. So instead of losing the title by 10, Elliott would have clinched the title by winning the season finale at Atlanta, even with Kulwicki running second.
And Jeff Gordon's name would replace Terry Labonte's on the 1996 trophy under the new system, as he won 10 races to Labonte's two. That would have easily wiped out Labonte's 37-point advantage.

Of course, that's 20-20 hindsight -- and strategies certainly would have varied based on the system in effect at the time. Still, it's an intriguing prospect.
At the same time, many of NASCAR's closest points battles wouldn't have changed hands. Even though Elliott won 11 races to Waltrip's three in 1985, Waltrip had enough of a cushion to hold on. The same holds true for Elliott in 1988, Rusty Wallace in 1989 and Earnhardt in 1990.
Even though Wallace won 10 races in 1993, he still wouldn't have caught Earnhardt, who won six times that season.
So how would the new rules have affected the first three Chases?
2004
No fewer than eight drivers had a chance to capture a spot in the Chase heading into Richmond. However, Ryan Newman would have gained 10 additional points for his two victories, which would have solidified his position.
Jeremy Mayfield's win would have moved him into the Chase under both systems, while Jamie McMurray and Kasey Kahne -- 11th and 12th, respectively, in the standings after Richmond -- would have been added to the expanded Chase.
Instead of starting with a 25-point cushion over Kurt Busch, Johnson would have been up 20 points -- the result for four "regular-season" victories compared to Busch's two.
However, the five-point bonus for winning races would have played a huge factor in determining the eventual champion. Because Johnson won four times in the final six races, he would have accumulated 20 additional points.
Busch won at New Hampshire, but instead of winning the title by eight points, he would have lost it by two.
.
2005
Gordon and Elliott Sadler would have been the two drivers added to the expanded Chase, but neither would have been a factor in the championship. Under the revised points, Gordon would have wound up eighth and Sadler 10th.
Stewart still would have been crowned champion by 20 points, although Carl Edwards and Greg Biffle would have made things more interesting at the end, since Edwards won twice during the Chase and Biffle once.
2006
The new Chase format would have taken much of the intrigue out of Richmond, leaving the 12th spot to be determined between Biffle and Edwards. Even that would have been anti-climatic, since Edwards wound up several laps down and in 35th place in the finale.
However, with the winner's bonus, not only would Stewart have easily made the 12-man Chase, he would have been just 20 points behind the leader after Richmond.
And coupled with his three wins in the final 10 races, Stewart would have wound up second, 16 points behind Johnson.
Matt Kenseth would have been third, with Kevin Harvick edging Denny Hamlin in a tiebreaker for fourth, thanks to two wins during the Chase.

[trollmc08]

I personally liked the old way, but seeing the powers that be didn't consult with me in the beginning of this chase thing, Then heres my take. I think the infancies of winning races is good. But that don't take in account the hard work of being a leader week in and week out. see if a team wanted to they could pick certain tracks and really over work those tracks and let some of the others go as long as you win enough races, you could steel be the leader.

[azrael492]

I think this is a great change. It has always bothered me that a driver just had to finish well and still do well in the points standings. I think they ought to take it a step further and everybody that wins a race should qualify for the chase. Then round out the top 12 with points leaders.

[Yelk]

Why does it make any difference what points system is used since everyone starts with ZERO points before the season starts and all compete through-out the year under the same points system? Everyone is racing for points.

[clutch]

They seem like good changes to me.....wasnt sure if 5 more was enough for the win, but if you make the chase you get 10 more for each win. I like that "seeding" as they call it.
.and I have no problem with 12 in the Chase

Good changes

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by Yelk

Why does it make any difference what points system is used since everyone starts with ZERO points before the season starts and all compete through-out the year under the same points system? Everyone is racing for points.

From my perspective ... when the points that are given for each race are as close as they are there is no incentive to go for a win. While I am not against consistency, I'd be happier if the whole premise of the championship were more based on wins versus points. Therefore it doesn't matter that they all start at zero points. Ultimately there should be more reward for a victory which would also serve as an incentive to try harder for the win instead of points racing.

Just my opinion.

[Hassan]

Even with these changes people will keep saying that there should be more points for winning and thats because drivers who win a race, they suffer from a bad finishes or DNF's which effects their position in the standings especially if other top drivers finish well, thats exactly was Kasey Kahne's case last season, he won 5 races in the first 26 races but he fell down because a streak of bad finishes while other drivers were finishing very well, in our sport drivers should run well all season if their seriouslly wanna title, no time to fall off the pace

[wardfan]

only 5 more points for a win, hell why bother

[wingkey1]

Not sure I buy in to the potential scenario that is -

Joe Driver finishes the first 26 races "tons" of points ahead of second place. The world of race fans sees his season as unprecedented in the history of the sport.

Frank 12th place (tons and tons of points behind) has 3 - 5 more wins than Joe Driver. He gets placed ahead of Joe Driver in the "Chase".



Seems there's an attempt to move the sport towards something those who better understand the "stick and ball" approach to the final results of a contest can better relate to. In a contest there is either a win or a loss. The winner gets one point, and everyone else gets zero. Yeah I know, most are 2 for a win, 1 for a tie, and 0 for a loss. But most/many of these sports don't really like the tie thing and have some attempt at a tie breaker (overtime, shootout, etc.).

Racing is more than a win or a loss. Not sure at times that is fully appreciated.


I dunno. Guess we'll just watch and see.

[Bob Tanner]

As\I "think" I understand it, the change is:
Five more points for a win during the entire season.
Twelve teams make the Playoff
No more 400-point cut
After the 26th race the top twelve will all get 5000 points then 1-12 position will be determined by adding ten points for each win. Ties will be broken by most number of seconds, then thirds then fourths, etc., etc.

They also changed the rules for The Winston but I still haven't completely figured those out yet. I know they now have four segments, not three.

To me it all proves a given in human nature.
In every culture there are simple rules which all members follow. As the bureaucracy within that culture grows in size, the rules are changed to become more and more confusing. Ultimately those rules are so confusing that it is virtually impossible to understand or follow them.

NASCAR hasn't reached its ultimate level yet but if you compare today's new and improved NASCAR to the NASCAR of thirty years ago I believe you will see that it is on its way.

[BringBackWilkesboro]

Originally Posted by wingkey1

Not sure I buy in to the potential scenario that is -

Joe Driver finishes the first 26 races "tons" of points ahead of second place. The world of race fans sees his season as unprecedented in the history of the sport.

Frank 12th place (tons and tons of points behind) has 3 - 5 more wins than Joe Driver. He gets placed ahead of Joe Driver in the "Chase".



Seems there's an attempt to move the sport towards something those who better understand the "stick and ball" approach to the final results of a contest can better relate to. In a contest there is either a win or a loss. The winner gets one point, and everyone else gets zero. Yeah I know, most are 2 for a win, 1 for a tie, and 0 for a loss. But most/many of these sports don't really like the tie thing and have some attempt at a tie breaker (overtime, shootout, etc.).

Racing is more than a win or a loss. Not sure at times that is fully appreciated.


I dunno. Guess we'll just watch and see.

I think you just summed it up for me. NA$CAR is beggining to move to a $tick and Ball sport, what with overtime (green white checkers), playoffs (the Chase, now with a seeding system too), "out of bounds" at the plate tracks, and greed. But, those things are hip (there's that word again) with the kids today, so Mr. France has to jump on it I guess. I think, to sum up the problem in a few words, Brian France is turning the sport into one big gimmick. The on track competition is now buried underneath all of it. Hmmmm, buried. I've said that before.

[LSC9901]

Originally Posted by BringBackWilkesboro

I think you just summed it up for me. NA$CAR is beggining to move to a $tick and Ball sport, what with overtime (green white checkers), playoffs (the Chase, now with a seeding system too), "out of bounds" at the plate tracks, and greed. But, those things are hip (there's that word again) with the kids today, so Mr. France has to jump on it I guess. I think, to sum up the problem in a few words, Brian France is turning the sport into one big gimmick. The on track competition is now buried underneath all of it. Hmmmm, buried. I've said that before.

Soon we'll be hearing the village idiots saying "and in this corner ........."

[clutch]

Originally Posted by Bob Tanner

As\I "think" I understand it, the change is:
Five more points for a win during the entire season.
Twelve teams make the Playoff
No more 400-point cut
After the 26th race the top twelve will all get 5000 points then 1-12 position will be determined by adding ten points for each win. Ties will be broken by most number of seconds, then thirds then fourths, etc., etc.

They also changed the rules for The Winston but I still haven't completely figured those out yet. I know they now have four segments, not three.

To me it all proves a given in human nature.
In every culture there are simple rules which all members follow. As the bureaucracy within that culture grows in size, the rules are changed to become more and more confusing. Ultimately those rules are so confusing that it is virtually impossible to understand or follow them.

NASCAR hasn't reached its ultimate level yet but if you compare today's new and improved NASCAR to the NASCAR of thirty years ago I believe you will see that it is on its way.

I am left to surmise that you are in fact not in favour of these changes Bob. Would that be correct?

I personally think that they have done a great job of tweeking the Chase.
15 more points for a win is a significant gain. And then the seeding...