[nflrunner]

I'm wondering if Manning has to win the SB, or did he get the monkey off his back by winning the AFC championship???

[EmpireWF]

He got the New England monkey off his back. But if he doesn't win a Super Bowl in his career, he won't be viewed in the same light as the Elways, Youngs or even Favre.

[Gotham Dark Knight]

Originally Posted by EmpireWF

He got the New England monkey off his back. But if he doesn't win a Super Bowl in his career, he won't be viewed in the same light as the Elways, Youngs or even Favre.

He can't be view in that light anyway...he is a bit higher up...

[Lefty Noob]

Why is it that QB is the only position this is even an issue? Seriously, if these guys still called their own plays, then okay, I buy it. But holding a QB to a different standard than anyone else? That's crazy. If Emmitt Smith never won a Super Bowl, would he have been placed under such scrutiny? Reggie White? No, those guys are rock solid Hall of Famers, ring or no ring, and Manning will be too.

[Notorious C.L.E.]

Originally Posted by Lefty Noob

Why is it that QB is the only position this is even an issue? Seriously, if these guys still called their own plays, then okay, I buy it. But holding a QB to a different standard than anyone else? That's crazy. If Emmitt Smith never won a Super Bowl, would he have been placed under such scrutiny? Reggie White? No, those guys are rock solid Hall of Famers, ring or no ring, and Manning will be too.

I don't think anyone has ever questioned that Manning belongs in Canton. I believe the criticism of his ability to win big games is not so much a knock on his Hall of Fame potential as it is a question on his spot as the greatest quarterback of all-time.

Quarterbacks are held to a different standard because they are the leaders of a football team. While Emmitt Smith was great, Aikman was the leader. While White was great, Favre was the leader.

[bresilhac]

Originally Posted by Notorious C.L.E.

I don't think anyone has ever questioned that Manning belongs in Canton. I believe the criticism of his ability to win big games is not so much a knock on his Hall of Fame potential as it is a question on his spot as the greatest quarterback of all-time.

Quarterbacks are held to a different standard because they are the leaders of a football team. While Emmitt Smith was great, Aikman was the leader. While White was great, Favre was the leader.

I agree. In no other sport it seems is there so much pressure to win the Championship. The ultimate prize, The Superbowl. Especially for QB's. If you don't win it you're a colossal loser and if you win it you're 'one of the greatest of all time'. Nobody doubts that Marino was a great QB. But with no ring he'll never be considered one of the greatest. Inasmuch as he had great stats but no Title to show for them.

[fredthefactor]

FIRSTTHINGS FIRST MANNING .
MANNY DIDN'T WHEN ANYTHING.
THE PATRIOTS CHOKED AND FELL APART AND GAVE THE GAME AWAY.
IF YOU REALLY WATCHED THE GAME!!!!
YOU WOULDN,T HAVE TO GET FRED FACT DO YOU FEEL ME?FIRST OF ALL THEY CHOKED.
THE COACH STEPPED TOTALY AWAY FROM THE GAME PLAN.
AND SHOWED THE WORLD HOW MUCH HE NEEDED HIS TWO SIDE KICKS.

[ThePundit]

Welcome to GoTeamsGo Nfl runner and FredTheFactor.

Fred: Great point about Belichick. He had brainlock when it came to the end of that game. On the Colts' final drive, he should have taken his his timeouts much earlier and left Brady with some time. But Manning still led his team back from 21-3. So I wouldn't short change him on that.

The answer to the bigger question, does Manning have to win this game to get the monkey off his back? The answer? Yes. Look- if he plays fabulously and loses 38-35 and doesn't throw a pick, that's another story, but to put a stamp on his HOF career, he has to win the game - just like Elway did.

[fredthefactor]

it's nice to know there are fans that watched the game instead of getting information from newspapers and/or radios.
theres one fact manny was about to choke his self to death if a little more pressure was applied by that substanderd defence.
now i'm not a Bear fan like my girls brothers however he's going to get served by a real defence 'SUNDAY'.
BELIEVE IT !!!!

[fredthefactor]

Originally Posted by fredthefactor

it's nice to know there are fans that watched the game instead of getting information from newspapers and/or radios.
theres one fact manny was about to choke his self to death if a little more pressure was applied by that substanderd defence.
now i'm not a Bear fan like my girls brothers however he's going to get served by a real defence 'SUNDAY'.
BELIEVE IT !!!!

[Notorious C.L.E.]

Originally Posted by fredthefactor

FIRSTTHINGS FIRST MANNING .
MANNY DIDN'T WHEN ANYTHING.
THE PATRIOTS CHOKED AND FELL APART AND GAVE THE GAME AWAY.
IF YOU REALLY WATCHED THE GAME!!!!
YOU WOULDN,T HAVE TO GET FRED FACT DO YOU FEEL ME?FIRST OF ALL THEY CHOKED.
THE COACH STEPPED TOTALY AWAY FROM THE GAME PLAN.
AND SHOWED THE WORLD HOW MUCH HE NEEDED HIS TWO SIDE KICKS.

Your right. Manning didn't win anything. He only threw for 350 yards and made some textbook throws to keep pressure drives alive.

I would love for you to explain me how the Patriots choked. Is it just because they were up by 18 points and ended up losing the game? The Patriots got tired when the Colts pushed the attack, plain and simple. There is nothing they could have done in order to stop Manning once they showed weakness. There were slight adjustments made in the gameplan, yes, but Belichick didn't step away from it entirely.

Originally Posted by fredthefactor

it's nice to know there are fans that watched the game instead of getting information from newspapers and/or radios. theres one fact manny was about to choke his self to death if a little more pressure was applied by that substanderd defense.
now i'm not a Bear fan like my girls brother however he's going to get served by a real defense 'SUNDAY'.
BELIEVE IT !!!

Did you watch the game?

How can you say he was about to choke? That is a completely baseless claim that lacks any real truth to it, especially since he was getting plenty of pressure on the final drive.

If you actually did watch the game, I'm sure you remember what I am talking about. It was 2nd and 10 from the Colts 31 yard line with 2:13 left, I believe, though I am not 100% sure on the time. Manning takes the snap and immediately the interior of the line collapses. Quite a few Patriots defenders got excellent penetration, forcing Manning to backpedal. With pressure in his face, he remained composed and noticed a streaking Bryan Fletcher along the left sideline. Forced to throw off his backfoot, he completed a 32-yard pass with pinpoint accuracy.

New England's defense isn't substandard by any means. They may be the most schematically disciplined team in the NFL, so I can't see where you are coming from there. They were tired, I think that much is evident. They had bouts of flu go through the locker room and played an incredibly physical game against San Diego. Is it a valid excuse for poor performance? Probably not, but I would love to see a fatigued defense try to matchup with that speed on offense and consistently dominate.

But, I guess I am just one of the fans that listens to the talking heads of the media. My opinions and knowledge of football is formulated by what I hear on WFAN. Silly me for thinking a seven play, eighty yard drive in just over a minute isn't choking.

[fredthefactor]

[quote=Notorious C.L.E.;85385]Your right. Manning didn't win anything. He only threw for 350 yards and made some textbook throws to keep pressure drives alive.

I would love for you to explain me how the Patriots choked. Is it just because they were up by 18 points and ended up losing the game? The Patriots got tired when the Colts pushed the attack, plain and simple. There is nothing they could have done in order to stop Manning once they showed weakness. There were slight adjustments made in the gameplan, yes, but Belichick didn't step away from it entirely.




Don't go there with me buddy.
If I recall it was maybe 4-5 mins left in the first half when manning started that drive to make it 21 to 6 before the half was over.
If you look at the screen close you will see that there was nine players on defense why?
Because, two corners were dropped back ten to fifteen yards in a prevent defensive sceme "CALLED CHOKING" or SCARED TO LOSE".
So that's what my opion is based on for the second half and it cost them the game.
Now if you look at it from that angle is it not easy to get 350 yards on a choked job of a game plan sir.
So don't even go there my brother in the game
Just keeping it real Fred the Factor.

[nflrunner]

You amaze me fredthefactor

Do you realize the Patriots were one play (4 yards) away from most likely winning that game? So to say they chocked is stupid and shows to me how blind or better yet how little you really know about the game.

nflrunner

[fredthefactor]

Look here sir the only reason why I am a patriots fan and said that they choked.
Because every superbowl they played in and they won were from the results of other teams choking.
This time the same reason applied to this game THE PATRIOTS CHOKED They did not have the cordinating gurus from the other superbowls.
So your point was they were 4 points away is an excuse at one point they were 18 points away from the colts and could have close the show but did they noooooooo!
FRED THE FACTOR. peace.

[nflrunner]

hmmmmmmmm so any team that loses a game (baseball, football,hockey,basketball etc...) chokes?

interesting never thought of it that way---AND NEVER WILL